Atheism and Christianity debate

[V-G]

Well... I guess.... sorry... didn't know... seemed like... anyways... want to talk about the Bible? Or you can always accept defeat, I don't mind hehe...

[bm-21Lemko]

[quote=StormAU;91807]1st what you feel and what is reality are 2 different things, I never said I was finished with a thread only to come back again, you however have. Will you chat with me or will you preach to me, if you are going to preach to me I'll keep on my merry way and prove what you are saying is wrong.
quote]

Whatever storm you win. Is that what you want to hear? I don't hate russians never have, never will, I am trying to hold back my anger towards your accusations. The only reason i came back was because you posted on three different threads that I hated Russians. I don't care, ok YOU WIN!!!! I'm Wrong.

Now it is impossible to be both a Christian and a Muslim, you either believe Jesus is the Son of God and trust in him or you don't. Christians believe in Jesus, that he IS the Son of God and they Trust in Him, Muslims do not. Do you see the major philosophical problem?

apparently this person does.

Inspirations and Creative Thoughts: "I am both Muslim and Christian" - Rev. Ann Holmes Redding | a beacon of hope in our troubled time

Lol I love this bit, So Gabriel come to Earth to personally tell us a 3rd time what was reality? Wow and here I was thinking God himself spoke to Noah and Moses etc, here I was thinking Jesus himself spoke to the people of Judah and Isreal etc, now your telling me it was Gabriel and that we got the first 2 times wrong. If that is what you believe then I question your sources and urge you to go and do some reading from the Bible. I'll give you a very quick summary, Jesus was the last messenger from God, the Apostles were the last men to write a Revelation from God. Sorry but that is the blunt truth, whether you accept or not accept that is totally up to you.

Wow you sound like the Jews, when Jesus came.

Well that is your interpretation Storm.

In Islam, Jesus (Isa) is also called the Messiah (Masih), but like in Judaism he is not considered to be the Son of God.

Maybe we interpretted it wrong, isn't there a words in hebrew that have multiple meanings.


"The Messiah (Jesus), son of Mary, was no more than a Messenger before whom many Messengers have passed away; and his mother adhered wholly to truthfulness, and they both ate food (as other mortals do). See how We make Our signs clear to them; and see where they are turning away!" (Quran 5:75).

"Remember when the Angels said "Oh Mary, God gives you glad tidings of a word from him (God) of the Messiah Jesus son of Mary, revered in this world and the hereafter, and one of those brought near to God. He will speak from the cradle as an infant and as a man will be of the righteous." She said "My Lord, how can I have a child when no mortal man has touched me?" He said, "So it will be. God creates what He wills, if He decrees a thing, He says to it only, 'Be!' and it is." (Qur'an 3:45-47)

[StormAU]

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

Whatever storm you win. Is that what you want to hear? I don't hate russians never have, never will, I am trying to hold back my anger towards your accusations. The only reason i came back was because you posted on three different threads that I hated Russians. I don't care, ok YOU WIN!!!! I'm Wrong.

I said hate or dislike thank you very much and I never singled you out.I also said japanese but no-one else has mentioned them apart from me, does that tell you I am talking in a general sense? You come back cause you want to keep going. It isn't about winning its about an adult discussion which I am starting to think you cant have.

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

apparently this person does.

Inspirations and Creative Thoughts: "I am both Muslim and Christian" - Rev. Ann Holmes Redding | a beacon of hope in our troubled time

There is no way to justify being both, Christians believe Jesus is the Messiah (Saviour) Muslims don't, I don't know what you find so hard about recognising the huge contradiction with that idea. If you don't believe Jesus is the Saviour (Son of God) then you are not Christian, the word Christian even indicates he is the centre religion.

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

Wow you sound like the Jews, when Jesus came .

No I don't, I can't speak either Hebrew , Aramaic, or Koine Greek.

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

Well that is your interpretation Storm.

In Islam, Jesus (Isa) is also called the Messiah (Masih), but like in Judaism he is not considered to be the Son of God.

Islam states Jesus is just a man, a mere mortal, Christianity states Jesus is God and is the saviour of those who choose to believe and trust in him.

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

Maybe we interpretted it wrong, isn't there a words in hebrew that have multiple meanings.

We interpreted it wrong? speak for yourself please, I am not the one saying that you can be Muslim and Christian at the same time. All languages have words that have multiple meanings so if you can find one that in Koine Greek (the language the NT was written in) that can be used to show that Jesus is not God when it actually states he is then please do and I'll convert to Islam instantly.

Originally Posted by bm-21Lemko

"The Messiah (Jesus), son of Mary, was no more than a Messenger before whom many Messengers have passed away; and his mother adhered wholly to truthfulness, and they both ate food (as other mortals do). See how We make Our signs clear to them; and see where they are turning away!" (Quran 5:75).

"Remember when the Angels said "Oh Mary, God gives you glad tidings of a word from him (God) of the Messiah Jesus son of Mary, revered in this world and the hereafter, and one of those brought near to God. He will speak from the cradle as an infant and as a man will be of the righteous." She said "My Lord, how can I have a child when no mortal man has touched me?" He said, "So it will be. God creates what He wills, if He decrees a thing, He says to it only, 'Be!' and it is." (Qur'an 3:45-47)

[/quote]Question for you, how often does your "Byzantine" Catholic priest use the Koran to preach? Why go to a Christian church only to disbelieve what is clearly stated in the book that the church itself rests on?

[V-G]

Ah! Chaos, Panic, Disorder! My work is done here ladies and gentlemen.

[bm-21Lemko]

Originally Posted by V-G

Well... I guess.... sorry... didn't know... seemed like... anyways... want to talk about the Bible? Or you can always accept defeat, I don't mind hehe...

Hey Volodya, I would like to talk about the Bible or the Quran. Your choice of debate.

Hey we can even debate the similarities and differences of christianity and Islam or whatever you want.

[V-G]

Hey Vasyl', can you tell me more about yourself? I am curious. From your posts I suspect you are older than Stepan (albeit your admission that you are about the same age). I say so because of your references to Economics as well as Religion and History. Your English is that of a native speaker and you reason very well (the whole "delusional" debate comes to mind, I was impressed how you turned it around with the belief in the non-existence, I mean it was good material).

Anyways, I'd be happy to share a few things about myself if you are interested.

Now, talking about the Bible. I don't believe the book was even inspired by God. I really don't. There are things in it that just give me the creeps, it was perhaps acceptable at the time it was written but it doesn't stand the test of time. read my post above, should we really stone children to death because they are disobedient? And saying that we shouldn't take the Bible literally isn't good enough, because if God almighty did inspire that book, it would have been written perfectly, it would have been crystal clear and would always apply (without having to guess things like - is there another way I could interpret this crap?).

-V

[bm-21Lemko]

I am 17, I will enter my last year of high school next year. I have lettered in swimteam since i have been a freshman. I can go a 25 sec in my 50 free and a 1:00 in my 100 fly. my favorite stoke is fly. I like cars. I have figure skated competively on a team and individually. I have played a lot of soccer but i no longer skate or play soccer. I took macro 103 and micro 102 in high school and have taken advance placement clases. I love history, theology has always been shrowed in mystery to me and I always asked my cadechist questions, some he could answer and others he couldn't Like why do I have to love god more than my parents (just one example) I use to live 40 miles from the Canadian border and went to Saskatchewan and winepeg a lot. I would say I like observing and learning which makes me reason well to a significant point.


-bible

11 If men get into a fight with one another, and the wife of one intervenes to rescue her husband from the grip of his opponent by reaching out and seizing his genitals, you shall cut off her hand; show no pity.

Gen 38:8-10

The question you asked below is a good one. I believe you are referring to the torah section of the bible or quran. If you have noticed there are a quite of few gruesome and violent stories in the torah.

Option one, the bible is a history book recording events that occured.

Option two, it is referred in the Bible that God is very jealous and at the time period not a lot of people believed in him, so maybe he made things strict so people would believe him with fear, no one questions fear. Right? Like Dictators?

Option three, they misinterrpretted it, but to must christians, its highly unlikely.



Now for the rest I don't know why they have some apostles books in the new testament and others they don't.

Volodya,

here we go. According to the hebrews there are two types of laws

1. Recieved from god at mt. Saini like the commandments.

2. Laws believed to be of human origin but divinely inspired, including Rabbinic decrees, interpretations, customs, etc.

so that is why they would have been acceptable at the time period because of number 2