Ukraine Image Abroad?

[Zbyszek]

Hi, JednaBrew you really had a nice entry into our little community. Your statistics is interesting and I can add that back in the beginning of my professional life, at the times of famous Solidarity protests, the estimated average personal income was 12*3500 zl per year in Poland so for that money you could buy roughly 12*3500/100=420 half litre bottles of 40% standard booze. Now, with 12*2500 new zl (pln) per year, you can buy 12*3000/20=1800 bottles. This makes a striking difference. However, it is not easy to get a reliable statistics while the ‘ants’ + mafia carry hectoliters of vodka (as well as thousands cigarettes) from Ukraine to Poland every single day. With so much difference in alcohol price in two countries, as quoted by JednaBrew, there is an obvious temptation to profit on it.

[73wanab]

Hey guys, didn't realize this is such a problem there. I live in a small own just off the Navajo Indian reservation, and alcoholism is a big problem there. They bring it into town as well, passing out in the park. Lots of "bootlegging" from the stores in town to the res. Against the law to have booze on the reservation. Seems this is a problem everywhere, but from what has been described here, it is a major problem in Poland and Ukraine. What I am going to see and experience when I arrive in Ukraine in 2 days? Is it hidden from sight, or in your face, so to speak, on the streets?

[73wanab]

Thanks Kathy. Not worried, just curious. I see it everyday here. Also have to deal with it at my store, since we sell beer and wine and my store is the last stop before getting on the reservation. Drunks come in all the time. If they are driving, YOUR BUSTED cause we call the cops! No wonder women on "marriage" sites all state, "without bad habits" in their profiles.

Less than 36 hours till I leave to visit Ukraine. Can you spell "nervous"!

[jedna_brew]

hello 73wanab

problem of heavy vodka drinkin concerns especially russia and ukraine. as i wrote before, poles has changed their culture of drinkin during last 20 years - they replased vodka with beer. polish culture of drinkin is now similar to czech, german or british.

i think the same shoul be done at ukraine. ukraine has fantastic weather conditions to produce vine (south of country), so i really think that they have great potential to avoid national health-disaster (caused by vodka), without the resignation from their culture.

[73wanab]

jedna_brew,
Thanks for your reply. Problem, getting wasted is getting wasted, vodka, beer or wine. Does not matter which. Getting drunk is getting drunk, just takes more by volume for beer and wine, but the result is still the same, correct? It is a mindset of the people. I don't blame them however. Communist State for decades. Who wouldn't want to get blitzed living under that system? I have grown up and lived in the "west", they have done the same in the "east", so to speak. We have EXACTLY the same problems. No frickin self control! You can't drown out your problems with alcohol, no matter where you live. Read between the lines. Is the situation there really different with beer and wine? Highly unlikely. Just using different numbers and stats to show a result that does not exist. Just my opinion, and I may be wrong! Later.

And by the way, 12 hours till Ukraine trip!

[jedna_brew]

73wanab,
yes, you have right - if someone wants to get drunk, replacing vodka vith beer doesn't change enything. but there is two importnant factors - money & time, because it takes more money and time to get drunk dinking e.g. wine. i mean that chosing lighter alcohol is better solution. drinking alcohol is common element for european culture, but there is a difference between glass o wine and glass of vodka.

it is better to change way of thinking of course, but this is much more hard to do. i think that "behavioral" way is better at the beginnig.

[jedna_brew]

Kathy, you have absolutely right...

edit-> i heard about cognacs, but never heard about ukrainian vines... can yuu give me more information?