Putin goes nuts: Slams New Vote

[Ulysses]

Putin Slams Ukrainian Opposition and Opposes New Vote

"PA"

Tens of thousands of optimistic opposition supporters waving Ukrainian flags and wearing orange armbands amassed in Kiev for the eleventh straight day to await a Supreme Court ruling that could decide whether a rerun of the disputed presidential election is held.

A grim-faced Russian President Vladimir Putin, meanwhile, told his Ukrainian counterpart Leonid Kuchma that the new vote would be pointless.

⌠A revote could be conducted a third, a fourth, 25th time, until one side gets the results it needs,■ Putin said sarcastically during his meeting with Kuchma at a Moscow military airport.

In Kiev, opposition leader Viktor Yushchenko criticised Kuchma▓s emergency flight to Russia, saying ⌠the source of power is located in Ukraine √ it▓s the Ukrainian people.■

The Kiev protesters gathered around television screens in the sprawling tent camp, drinking hot tea to fight off the chill. Even Ukraine▓s parliament temporarily put off its morning session to await the court ruling.

The Supreme Court▓s sitting to consider an opposition appeal against the election results has dominated Ukrainian television, which has broadcast live from the cramped courtroom.

The Supreme Court was expected to rule on the appeal by Yushchenko▓s campaign to invalidate the run-off result, based on claims of widespread violations across Yanukovych▓s eastern and southern strongholds.

The run-off has been discredited by both sides, with Yanukovych √ the officially declared winner √ submitting his own appeal against the results, focusing on pro-Yushchenko western provinces and the capital.

The Supreme Court today rejected Yanukovych▓s objections to parts of the opposition▓s appeal, leaving open the possibility that the judges might name Yushchenko president based on first-round results, which he won by a narrow margin.

Ruslan Knyazevich, a member of the Central Election Commission who refused to sign the official results, told the court that after the polls closed, ⌠one million more votes were thrown in.■ He said election data from the east came in later than from other regions, after what he suggested was an order to ⌠increase the numbers.■

With the court widely expected to declare the vote invalid, the mood in Kiev was celebratory.

A Christmas tree √ in opposition orange √ was erected in the tent camp, and outside the Cabinet building, where the opposition supporters kept up their blockade.

⌠We aren▓t letting anyone through. Why should we? We are so close to victory, why surrender now?■ said Natalya Nechipurenko, 38, who wore an orange armband around her arm and a sticker reading ⌠security■ pinned to her coat.

A new election in this bitterly divided nation of 48 million is looking increasingly possible, but what remains unclear is whether Ukraine will stage a repeat of the run-off, as Yushchenko is demanding √ or start the election from scratch, as Kuchma proposed.

Kuchma has pushed for a completely new election in apparent hopes of fielding a new, more popular successor as his government scrambles to stay in power with his 10 years in office running out.

[Voyager13b]

Ulysses,

When the Supreme Court declared today that testimony from members of the Central Election Committee made it clear that the results of the runoff were a fraud, and that the runoff must be recast later this Month, I almost felt pity for Kuchma and Putin. The Court ruling is final, and not subject to any appeal. That includes consultations between Kuchma and Putin. I'm sure their meeting took place in an effort to send a clear message to the Supreme Court, and for them to hear the court base their decision on facts of the investigation, rather than on solidarity between the Kiev and Moscow power centers must have felt like a steel toed boot to the groin.

I did have a laugh when Putin made his comment about the possibility that the election could end up running over and over again until a final result is declared legal. He should have ended the comment with the line "Yanuck, Kuchma, and I worked very hard, and I spent lots of money to make sure that the election came out right the first time. To call for a quick revote with increased scrutiny doesn't give us enough time to make sure our initial effort and expense will prevail again".

That would have been honesty.

Good luck Ukraine, stay whole, and prosper.


Voyager

[Ulysses]

Voy,

For the life of me, I can't figure out what Putin hopes to accomplish by having so many outbursts in public so frequently. Instead of projecting anger and assertiveness, his outbursts are starting to project frustration and powerlessness. His recent behavior is unbecoming of a head of state:

"We in Russia cannot support such a development of events, even if somebody wants to call it democracy."

Putin rejected Western accusations, saying Russia acted "absolutely correctly" in disputes throughout the former Soviet Union. He suggested forces in the West were seeking to create new divisions in Europe for their political purposes. "I don't want, as in Germany, for us to divide Europe into westerners and easterners, into first-class and second-class people, where the first-class people have the opportunity to live by stable, democratic laws and the second category of people are those with, to speak metaphorically, dark political skin," Putin said.

He said the second-class people would be subjected to "a nice but stern man in a helmet who will show them under what political understanding they must live. And if, God forbid, the ungrateful foreigner resists, he will be punished with bombs and missiles, as it was in Belgrade. I consider this completely unacceptable."

[Alex_Ivanov]

Originally posted by Voyager13b

I did have a laugh when Putin made his comment about the possibility that the election could end up running over and over again until a final result is declared legal. He should have ended the comment with the line "Yanuck, Kuchma, and I worked very hard, and I spent lots of money to make sure that the election came out right the first time. To call for a quick revote with increased scrutiny doesn't give us enough time to make sure our initial effort and expense will prevail again".


He meant that if Ukr. president is already chosen by the West, they will continue to spend money again and again to make any other result, other than victory of their puppet, look illegal. Since Russia has less money than west does, she can't really hope to win this game. But she can (and will) try.

Great result that coup is, in fact, failed. Plot was to take power in a few days, like it was done in Serbia and Georgia before. It failed. And that's our little victory.

[Voyager13b]

Originally posted by Alex_Ivanov

Alex,

I knew what Putin meant, and I still think my bit of sarcasm expressed what he felt to a degree, as he was hoping for an uncontested Yanuck victory, and put his political clout in that corner. I have no problem with that, as everyone is entitled to their opinion, even heads of foreign states. No matter, as what you called "our little victory" is indeed, our victory. As in yours and mine. It can be easy to call the protest an attempted coup, and if the government was changed by force of mob, I would have been against it. As it stands to date (and to my great relief), it was a protest against a 'silent coup' that attempted to take control of the nation through ballot stuffing. The protest used every legal means available to make it's accusations and seek relief. The Supreme court of the nation had the final word after several days of listening to evidence from both sides, and agreed that the official outcome was tainted by rampant fraud. A new election that will be closely monitored is set for later this Month. Either candidate can win the 'clean' runoff by convincing enough individual, live voters to cast a ballot in their favor.

The way things stand today, no matter who wins on the 26th, is that all of Ukraine had a great victory. There was no coup from either party, the government addressed the crisis in a lawful manner, and the system worked.

In the future, that will account for more national pride and world respect than any revolution, velvet or lead.

Voyager

[B_Ungaro]

Some of the esteemed members are refusing to consider the possibility of INTERFERRENCE from the WEST, including the USA.

From what I read, the media in Kiev and West of Kiev is in the camp of Yuschenko. I have yet to read any news from the Eastern Part. All this just seems too convenient.

The current edition of the Economist has a couple of fair articles on Ukraine. Go to: http://www.economist.com

[Alex_Ivanov]

Voyager, we have completely different views on the nature of this "protest", and I can't agree that peaceful solution was desired by both sides at the beginning.

I don't think that Yuschenko wanted just to say that he doubts official results. He wanted to take power without reelection, and made some illegal steps in that direction (declaring himself president etc.) But when large part of society opposed him, he began talks. As I said once, expressed separatism of Eastern oblasts paradoxically saved Ukraine as united state - it cooled some heads at Kiev streets.

Peaceful outcome of situation is, in fact, victory of ant-Yuschenko side (please note, I don't call it pro-Yanukovich side ). That was what I meant by "our little victory".

But finally it benefits both sides, so our victory became "our" indeed.