Unemployment and standard of living in Ukraine

[Aala]

MANY Ukrainians leave their country to go "westwards" - to earn some money in order to keep their families alive. Many of them work in Czechia and live here in POOR conditions which I would compare to homelessness, even if most of them (with exceptions) have a place where to sleep. What must the life in Ukraine be like if they are willing to accept this (low salaries as a reward for hard work, isolation, humbling... )?

I don't have much information on the situation in Ukraine but I can imagine that the lower class people must be in a difficult situation, maybe they even starve! Can anyone of you, who live in Ukraine, describe the situation (unemployment, standard of living...) Am I mistaken or right?

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by Aala
MANY Ukrainians leave their country to go "westwards" - to earn some money in order to keep their families alive. I don't have much information on the situation in Ukraine but I can imagine that the lower class people must be in a difficult situation, maybe they even starve! Can anyone of you, who live in Ukraine, describe the situation (unemployment, standard of living...) Am I mistaken or right?

I know that many Ukrainians go to Poland for bettering their situation. They are generally viewed with sympathy in Poland. They make some street trading here or they work, unfortunately usually illegally. Poles do not make a big problem of this and they do not regard it as bad. Ukies have good opinion here as orderly, not freakish workers. Sometimes they commit crimes but the most of them are their internal accounts.
I personally know some friends who employ Ukrainians. For us, it is a good opportunity to get a first-hand information on the country's real situation.
Sometimes we are shocked by the stories of the extreme poverty in Ukraine. We also hear a lot about the rampant corruption and the post Soviet beaurocratic nomenclature.
The present image does not apear to be very optimistic but I remember so well the time when Poles so frequently worked in Western Europe and they got much support and help they needed badly. I always respect hard-working people who have enough courage to come to another country looking for honest chances.
Yes, Ukraine used to be and still is a country close to Poland, not only in geographic terms. Nice to know that we do not need an interpreter around when we would like to talk a little.

[Edited by Zbyszek on 10th September 2002 at 19:04]

[Aala]

Well, thank you for your opinion, Zbyszek. In fact it's completely the same as mine. But the situation in Czechia and Poland differs a lot. Many people here hold Ukrainians in contempt and others abuse them as servants, they ask (or order) them to do things which they'd never dare ask Czech workers. An example-a lady who employed an Ukrainian mason let him sleep in a garden shed when the temperature dropped below 10C. He accepted, he needed the job. She left him an electrical kettle-but she "forgot" about a mug. (Such people-I mean the lady, of course-don't deserve a least bit of respect. Fortunately, not all people are like this-her neighbours lent the poor guy some heating and covers, dishes...). This woman also made him help her seat trees in her garden (considering it his duties) and other things like that which she'd never thing of asking any Czech for.
And there're many cases that don't differ much from this one.

But the worst problem is not in these individual cases but in the society as a whole. The Ukrainians are viewed as those who occupy jobs which could otherwise be occupied by Czechs. But it's untrue! No Czech would work so hard for so low salary, we sort of need them.

I deeply disapprove the behavior of my fellow citizens. Those who criticize Ukies should better learn from them. I'm quite sad about it all. But one person cannot change it. At least I try to be polite to Ukrainians I meet (and to all foreigners and actually to all people) though some of my friends don't understand it.

One thing occured to me now-how is it that we accept Slovaks kindly? The answer that we lived in one state with them is not satisfactory for me. A part of Ukraine (around Mukachevo) was once a part of Czechoslovakia, too!

P.S. Zbyszek, as for the language, it's not easy for me to understand Ukrainian but I'd get used to it soon if I had the chance to listen to it often-as I got used to spoken Polish (from TV).

[Andrej]

Indeed, quite sad. I lived in Pragha in 1996 and I really loved the place. I didn't speak any Czech, and my English was rather limited at the time, but tell me what do Czechs think about Russians ? Is there still resentment, or have you as a people moved on ?

[Zbyszek]

Andrej, your rather pessimistic statement posted recently made me find something encouraging for you and surely for Aala also. I spent my last weekend in a small, lovely Polish village working hard all day and finally in the evening I made a fire in my old-fashioned kitchen stove. I turned on the old fashioned TV set. I was lucky to have a chance to see a report of a wonderful charity concert from Wroclaw, now a Polish town of long and interesting history. Several centuries ago this town was Polish, then Czech, than German for a looooooong time.
Wroclaw was hit by a disastrous flood in 1997. Water reached fourth floor in some buildings. Poles were helped by German and Czech people then.
This year the Golden Prague was hit in a terrible way. Wroclaw people gave help! They collected a lot of money for restoring one of the Prague palaces placed on Veltava river island. The concert began with the Ahoy , a Czech equivalent of Hello.
I realize my post is off the topic here so finally to get it right I would like to mention that Wroclaw is largely inhabited by former Lvovians who were kicked out of Ukraine during and after WWII.

[Andrej]

Why is it that tragedy, death or struggle always brings out tbe best in people ?...

[Aala]

Originally posted by Andrej
Indeed, quite sad. I lived in Pragha in 1996 and I really loved the place. I didn't speak any Czech, and my English was rather limited at the time, but tell me what do Czechs think about Russians ? Is there still resentment, or have you as a people moved on ?

Good news for you! It's definitely improving!
Now that people have better information, they are discovering that they can't blame only Russia/USSR for 40 years of communism-at the very beginning, it was the people's decision-communist party won the democratic elections in 1946. On the other hand, the military invasion of states of Warsaw Treaty in 1968 under the leadership of the USSR can't be easily forgotten.
Many young people start to learn Russian, and it's a good sign. A few years ago, Russian wasn't taught at schools. Now many of them offer Russian as an elective subject. (As for me, I find Russian the most beautiful language of all).
Even most of the older people don't feel any negative emotions if you speak about Russians.
After the Velvet Revolution, the best news of Russia was NO news. The topic of RUSSIA was taboo. These times are gone, too.

In general, the view of Russians is rather neutral. People are still afraid of thinking about them in a positive way but feel no need for negative views.