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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 13th August 2014, 17:44
MichaelB_PL MichaelB_PL is offline
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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
This is all pile of rubbish. I know everyone has a his own view on history and that is it.
Actually, the "everyone has his own view" is basically a justification, an attempt to defend views which are simply not based on reality. Usually, when somebody is saying things like "everyone has his own views", it's a defense of things which simply cannot be defended using any rational arguments.

On the other hand, the things I wrote are simply true, supported by historical facts - for example, it is indisputable historical truth that while Ukrainians were indeed second class citizens in pre-1939 Poland, they STILL had more rights and more freedom than Ukrainians living under the Soviet Union, not to mention Ukrainians in Poland were not dying in millions from hunger.

I do realise that Russians are indoctrinated with propaganda version of history which makes them more or less unable to acknowledge facts like above, but that's a pathology concerning Russians, not history as such. I guess it's a painful feeling to realise that what you've been told your entire life was a lie and that the "glorious" Russian history is in reality a tradition of a culturally semi-Asiatic tyranny, the seed of which was planted by the Mongols.

Of course it's not that Russians are the only one having this - the Turks have the same, having problems accepting the Armenian Genocide, Ukrainians have this when it comes to ackowledging the true nature and deeds of their fascist heroes (Bandera, OUN, UPA, etc). But I think Russians are the only ones whos view of history seems to be propaganda-filled from the bottom up.

BTW to eliminate potential misguided, propaganda-derived thoughts that might arise in your head - I don't buy American/Western propaganda and I actually support the Russians separatists in this conflict. But unlike you, I don't buy Russian propaganda either.

Quote:
That is why is American Satanist empire aggressively attacking Russia,
I think the use of the word "Satanist" speaks volumes about your objectivity.

Quote:
Poland used to be proud nation and today it is DEEP in an American ass,
I agree and I don't like it. But then again I prefer that to being under Russian domination.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 06:31
Davor Davor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB_PL View Post
Actually, the "everyone has his own view" is basically a justification, an attempt to defend views which are simply not based on reality. Usually, when somebody is saying things like "everyone has his own views", it's a defense of things which simply cannot be defended using any rational arguments.

On the other hand, the things I wrote are simply true, supported by historical facts - for example, it is indisputable historical truth that while Ukrainians were indeed second class citizens in pre-1939 Poland, they STILL had more rights and more freedom than Ukrainians living under the Soviet Union, not to mention Ukrainians in Poland were not dying in millions from hunger.

I do realise that Russians are indoctrinated with propaganda version of history which makes them more or less unable to acknowledge facts like above, but that's a pathology concerning Russians, not history as such. I guess it's a painful feeling to realise that what you've been told your entire life was a lie and that the "glorious" Russian history is in reality a tradition of a culturally semi-Asiatic tyranny, the seed of which was planted by the Mongols.

Of course it's not that Russians are the only one having this - the Turks have the same, having problems accepting the Armenian Genocide, Ukrainians have this when it comes to ackowledging the true nature and deeds of their fascist heroes (Bandera, OUN, UPA, etc). But I think Russians are the only ones whos view of history seems to be propaganda-filled from the bottom up.

BTW to eliminate potential misguided, propaganda-derived thoughts that might arise in your head - I don't buy American/Western propaganda and I actually support the Russians separatists in this conflict. But unlike you, I don't buy Russian propaganda either.



I think the use of the word "Satanist" speaks volumes about your objectivity.



I agree and I don't like it. But then again I prefer that to being under Russian domination.


Everyone has his own view and support his view.

My view of your history is view of neutral man. If you say that it was good to burn Moscow, the same thing will Russian say about what they did.

Ukrainians support Bandera as a national hero, and Poles as a victims of Bandera have opposite view.

So it is useless to argue about this.


I don't support anyone in this war but I am aware that this war is organised by West and USA, they established this so/called government actyallu JUNTA in Kiev. And JUNTA is commiting very hard war crimes in the east of Ukraine.This GOVERNMENT in KIEV is absolute puppet of USA and NATO and they will send as many young Ukrainians in death as Americans say. West don't care about how many they kill each other. Anglosaxons consider Slavic peoples as a lower race and second class humans.

If we talk about America, NATO and West, I don't care what you think because facts say that USA and NATO are war crime machinery that spread DEATH and DESTRUCTION wherever they go, they leave chaos behind and civil wars.


They are the most evil power today. And MY COUNTRY and YOUR COUNTRY participate in these crimes as allies of USA and NATO, whether you and me like that fact or not..

Russia and China are only who stood up in their way and they propose MULTI POLAR world as opposite to USA who want world where USA rules by dictate, and destroy everyone who try to oppose to them.

That is why I support Russia and China and I always will. If Russia tries to do what America does I would be against such Russian politics.

And this make me sick when people say" I prefer that to being under Russian domination" This is always an excuse for USA neocons in commiting the worst crimes and violence. This I stupidity, you always start from the point that you will be ****ed, and better to be ****ed by this one than by that one.

Point is to establish international rules in which there is not such a domination. Why should you and why would you be under any domination? You belong to nation with great tradition and great history and you shoul think like this and not think in such colonial mentality way.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 13:50
BlueandGold BlueandGold is offline
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Cool Moscow's Domination

Remember the Warsaw Pact after WWII?

It was Moscow's Treaty of Friendship and property relocation for other nations:

East Germany.
Poland.
Ukraine.
Hungary.
Bulgaria.
Czechoslovakia.
Romania.
Albania.
Yugo/slavia.

In other words, it was Moscow's domination of once independent and free nations of Europe.

Under Moscow's rule - STATE RULE - they had:

No private property rights.
No civil rights.
No freedom of assembly.
No freedom of the press.
No freedom of religion.


And nothing to worry about…

Poland and Ukraine remember Moscow's tyranny.
Hungary too.

Ukraine is still fighting it.

In Jesus Christ's Holy name, may peace be with you always.
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One Ukraine
One Hetman
One bowl of Borsch
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 15:10
BlueandGold BlueandGold is offline
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Cool A~Between~seas~Commonwealth~

Thank you Gavrilo!

I enjoy reading your posts.
You ask a good question!

Jozef Piłsudski was a true Polish visionary.
People just didn't listen and then... it was too late, WWII started.

By Gavrilo,
 
"Ok, let us speak about more optimistic things.

Let us stay above current gray reality and every day politics.
This crisis in Ukraine will settle down and life would move on. i am sure, Ukrainians and Russians would solve their problems.

But, one day,... should Ukrainians decide to move on together with Poles and Serbs, Czechs, Slovaks,...
in general with Slavic and non-Slavic countries of Eastern and Central Europe,... if in some future (sooner the better),
some new Commonwealth appear on horizon and, from a dream, turn to be reality, while at the same time, European Union prove to be failure?

Having positive experiences from time of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, where Serbs even played role of the military elite,
idea of the new Commonwealth is more and more popular in my country (Serbia). It comprehend that only Commonwealth can secure interests of people
who live between west of Europe and Russia, from Baltic to Balkan and Ukraine. European Union seams to focus solely on interests of the western European countries,
while Russia always represented system for itself.

Anyway, what rest of us, in between big powers in Europe can do then to turn to ideas about restoration of Commonwealth.

Intermarium / New Commonwealth - Global player

See, i am curious to found out what brotherly Ukrainians think about possibility of creation of new Commonwealth?"

A sea to sea commonwealth. It's definitely good for trade!

A modern version of Piłsudski's idea is a good one!
Like a mini NATO for mutual protection.

More like of the people of central Europe.
Not of the Corporation or of Moscow.

By the way, welcome to UKRAINE.COM

Take care.

In Jesus Christ's Holy name, may peace be with you always.
__________________

One Ukraine
One Hetman
One bowl of Borsch
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 15:42
BlueandGold BlueandGold is offline
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Cool Ukrainian's Right of Self Defense

"Legitimate use of violence can only be that which is required in self-defense."
Ron Paul

"Murder begins where self-defense ends."
Georg Buchner

"Arms in the hands of citizens may be used at individual discretion in private self defense.”
~John Adams

"I have a very strict gun control policy: if there’s a gun around, I want to be in control of it.”
~Clint Eastwood

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."
Thomas Jefferson

Dear people of Ukraine: in Jesus Christ's name, peace be with you.

Take care.
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One bowl of Borsch
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 18:03
Davor Davor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueandGold View Post
Remember the Warsaw Pact after WWII?

It was Moscow's Treaty of Friendship and property relocation for other nations:

East Germany.
Poland.
Ukraine.
Hungary.
Bulgaria.
Czechoslovakia.
Romania.
Albania.
Yugo/slavia.

In other words, it was Moscow's domination of once independent and free nations of Europe.

Under Moscow's rule - STATE RULE - they had:

No private property rights.
No civil rights.
No freedom of assembly.
No freedom of the press.
No freedom of religion.


And nothing to worry about…

Poland and Ukraine remember Moscow's tyranny.
Hungary too.

Ukraine is still fighting it.

In Jesus Christ's Holy name, may peace be with you always.

USSR and today Russia are different countries.

Andif we talk about hegemony, talk to Latin Americans who experienced more than century of USA terror, robery, CIA-sponsored military coups, with dead squads and fascist dictatorship, merciless exploatation ...,

Actually read this and enjoy

History of U.S. Military Interventions since 1890

And Ukraine is fighting WHO?

Ukraine is independent 24 years and did not have problems until USA and NATO installed illegal JUNTA after removing elected government by force. They brought to power BAndera supporters. One part of Ukraine did not agree on that nd you have war in East Ukraine. Junta is klling their own citizens instead to talk to them This so/called government is apsolutelly puppet government and real power is USA and CIA.
USA wanted to get Russia into the war in Ukrainebut so far they failed. Rusians arenot so stupid and now unta and their USA masters don't know what to do.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 14th August 2014, 18:14
Davor Davor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueandGold View Post
Remember the Warsaw Pact after WWII?

It was Moscow's Treaty of Friendship and property relocation for other nations:

East Germany.
Poland.
Ukraine.
Hungary.
Bulgaria.
Czechoslovakia.
Romania.
Albania.
Yugo/slavia.

In other words, it was Moscow's domination of once independent and free nations of Europe.

Under Moscow's rule - STATE RULE - they had:

No private property rights.
No civil rights.
No freedom of assembly.
No freedom of the press.
No freedom of religion.


And nothing to worry about…

Poland and Ukraine remember Moscow's tyranny.
Hungary too.

Ukraine is still fighting it.

In Jesus Christ's Holy name, may peace be with you always.

USSR and today Russia are different countries.

And if we talk about hegemony, talk to Latin Americans who experienced more than century of USA terror, robery, CIA-sponsored military coups, with dead squads and fascist dictatorship, merciless exploatation ...,

Actually read this and enjoy

History of U.S. Military Interventions since 1890

P.S. On that list remove Yugoslavia after 1948, and Albania after 1967 because they left socialist bloc.
Also in these two countries communists did not come to power with Red Army. They had their own partisan movement lead by communists which took power in 1945.
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