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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 14:46
Gavrilo Gavrilo is offline
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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
polish political elite today is the same as the all other political elites in Europe - American servants, deep in American ass.
i wouldn`t tell it better

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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
Only one state in Europe is independent and free - Russia.
i concur here, too.

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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
And all of this mess in Ukraine is actually USA and NATO war against Russia, aiming its destabilisation and possible destruction.
Yes. Its primary what moving west of Europe and USA. They want resources. They want that their children have and who gives a sh** for others.

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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
Ukraine is just collateral damage and they fight for USA interests.
Yes, Ukraine is collateral damage, i agree. As was Yugoslavia and Serbia. But, let us don`t forget the other side of the medal. Ethnic Ukrainians who consider themselves to be unique nation has every right to have its own state and to be independent. In this process don`t get help neither from EU/NATO leading powers, neither from Russia. But, at least Russia tried. We see that by Russian readiness to accept formation of Ukraine, within its back then borders, after dissolution of Soviet Union. Russia was ready to accept Ukrainian wishes for uniqueness but, obviously ethnic Russian within Ukraine lived as hostages of situation.

In short (to shorten this elaboration),... Russia thought that is balance of power provided. Then, EU/NATO leading powers played sinister game and balance was destroyed. Now, Ukrainians ignoring Russians and Russians ignore Ukrainians, within Ukraine.

What they need are honest negotiations about new border between Ukraine and Russia. Solution offered by communists obviously was idiotic. Let then both- Ukrainians and Russians, after honest peace occur, live in peace.

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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
But they don't see that, blind in their anti-Russian hatred and extreme Bandera-style nationalism.
banderists are foreign players within Ukraine. Same what were/are ustashe in germanized Croatia.

But its ok. Serbians would help to Ukrainian to open their eyes. We Serbs are only capable to say truth to anyone (plus to admit it to ourselves). To west of Europe, to USA, to Russia, to Ukrainians.

Russia should show more respect and, as for Anglos and Germanics- penis between their eyes. Strangers should just f*** off their greedy fingers from Slavia.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 15:49
GoodLuckUkraine GoodLuckUkraine is offline
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Stop spouting ancient cold war nonsense you two. Russia isn't independent and free, it is isolated and completely dependent on the West for technology, food and capital markets.

The US, EU and NATO have treated Putin far better than he deserves in the hope of fostering lasting peace and co-operation only to find that Putin's brain is still back in the Cold War.

The US, EU and NATO are not a threat to Russia, they have all been cutting military spending and removing military men and machines from Europe for many years now. Only in Putin's mind, and the minds of those who have fallen for his propaganda, is the West a threat.

The threat to Russia now is the far more powerful, booming economy of 1.6 billion, rather cramped, Chinese people over the other side that Putin is virtually ignoring whilst they are investing countless billions expanding their armed forces...why do you think that might be?

China could crush Russia like a bug if it so wished and Putin would serve his people much better if he focused his attention in that direction, not at Ukraine which is going to join the EU eventually no matter what he does or how many revolutions it takes.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 17:17
Hannia Hannia is offline
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Russian citizens are indeed free and independent, short of their freedom to travel out of the Federationl*** and their access to internet.
==========================================================================================
Russian Internet Censorship, Social Media Crackdown Make It Easy For Putin To Stay Popular
By Jeff Stone

Western media observers have been alarmed by the series of Russian laws passed that give the Kremlin an increased ability to police the Internet. For liberal Russians, and bloggers in particular, the newest limitations are just the latest part of a disturbing trend of new restrictions on Internet media that, not coincidentally, began when Vladimir Putin retook the presidency in 2012.
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Putin has chipped away at Internet freedom in Russia since he returned to the Kremlin in 2012, blaming social media platforms for helping organize massive Moscow street protests that attracted thousands of people chanting “Russia without Putin.” Since then he’s casually referred to the Internet as a Central Intelligence Agency plot against Russia, offered a $110,000 bounty for anyone able to crack the Tor anonymity network, and last week enacted a law that forces all bloggers with 3,000 or more daily readers to register with the government.

Popularly known as the “law on bloggers,” that legislation compels online writers (who until now have enjoyed the web as one of the last places in Russia where dissidence went uncensored) to provide their home address and other details to a government that is, in many cases, the subject of their work.

Bloggers will now be held to the same standard of mass media outlets: Writers are forbidden from using foul language (which is now equated with “hooliganism”) and spreading false information, a loosely defined term that puts the onus on the writer, not the subject, to prove his claim.
If a blogger insinuates that a public official is corrupt and they can’t provide it they could face very steep fines,” Kevin Rothrock, a Russian policy analyst and chief editor of RuNet Echo, which aims to increase understanding of the Russian Internet, told the International Business Times. “It’s certainly not like the American law when you can call President Obama a Nazi Martian and he can’t do anything about it just because he’s a public official.”

Like the difference between Russian “false information” and U.S. libel law, the cultural gap has made it difficult for Western observers to comprehend just how, after ***** Riot and vast media consolidation, Putin can get away with yet another restriction on free speech. But with an approval rating that’s soared since the annexation of Crimea, Putin has only become more popular among his constituents by giving Moscow more control over the Internet. (Recent polling puts his popularity at 83 percent, a level only rivaled in the U.S. by President George W. Bush in the weeks following Sept. 11, 2001.)

“Russia historically has a top-down order and the Internet flies in the face of that. People prefer to have things neat and tidy and the blogosphere is the complete opposite of that,” Rothrock said, adding that liberal “bloggers unanimously oppose the law.”

Major Russian bloggers and popular social media users, whom the law also applies to, have yet to even be affected, and it is unclear what will happen when they are. There’s been no public declaration of how the offending posts will be removed and what the penalty will be, other than threats of a fine and blacklisting from the Russian Internet. It’s possible that if an individual tweets something in violation of the law, for instance, regulators will try to force the Internet service provider to remove the tweet, or remove Twitter altogether.

“Russia usually backs down when opposed to major social media platforms,” Rothrock said. “It’s a waiting game until they add someone to the registry who doesn’t want to be there.”

Putin’s dismissal of the Internet as an ongoing CIA project was turned into a punchline in the West, but his attitude is a reflection of how countless Russians feel about the web. That paranoia only increased with the disclosures from National Security Agency whistleblower Edward Snowden last year.

The president signed a law last month forcing all online companies conducting business inside Russian borders to store six months’ worth of data at facilities located inside Russia. Starting in September 2016, if U.S.-based companies like Twitter, Google and Facebook want to operate on Russian soil, they must also be prepared to turn over data to Russian security services upon request, without a court ruling or any kind of justification.

“And we’re not talking about Russian user data, but rather all personal information of any user who happens to have some readers from Russia – like, say, Barack Obama, who has no less than 3,000 Russian nationals among the 40.5 million subscribers to his Facebook page,” Anton Nossik, the first-ever Russian blogger, wrote for the New Republic. “Twitter should also prepare to move all of Obama’s personal data to Russia and hand it over to the FSB, since both Putin and Medvedev are his followers on twitter. If any of these companies don’t comply they would be subject to administrative fines, up to 500,000 roubles [$14,000], and Russian ISPs would have to block access to these platforms.”
Russian Internet Censorship, Social Media Crackdown Make It Easy For Putin To Stay Popular
=============================================================================================
***Word on the beach is that there is a new type of Russian tourist in Crimea. Since the crisis erupted in Ukraine, up to four million Russians who work for the state have been effectively banned from leaving the country - it's rumoured that the government views holidays abroad as a security risk in their case. Since Sergei is an Interior Ministry official, I ask if he can still go holiday wherever he likes.
BBC News - Tourism takes a nosedive in Crimea



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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 17:31
Gavrilo Gavrilo is offline
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Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
Stop spouting ancient cold war nonsense you two. Russia isn't independent and free, it is isolated and completely dependent on the West for technology, food and capital markets.
doze of truth has been said here. but, not that is Russia dependent in some extent but, what is especially disguising to us Serbs, Russia often accept to collaborate with Germany. Its not nice.

Anyway, west of Europe and USA are stupid. They now sanctioning Russia. What an imbecilic mistake. But, God knows what he doing. As my grandmother used to say- When God wants to punish you, God takes you brain. That is how God punished so called west. Took them brain. He, he.

So, Russia would be less dependent. Now, NATO/EU leading powers face rising opposition. They should worry

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
The US, EU and NATO have treated Putin far better than he deserves in the hope of fostering lasting peace and co-operation only to find that Putin's brain is still back in the Cold War.
Politicians are politicians and, politicians of big powers are generally biggest scum. Look what west of Europe and USA did to Yugoslavia or now to Ukraine.

But, i would still say, that Russia just tries to cope. Russia simple don`t have power to behave that pervert as behave NATO/EU leading powers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
The US, EU and NATO are not a threat to Russia, they have all been cutting military spending and removing military men and machines from Europe for many years now. Only in Putin's mind, and the minds of those who have fallen for his propaganda, is the West a threat.
The US, EU and NATO leading powers are threat to Russia. To entire Earth.

As for Putin... let me tell you something- he is weakling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
The threat to Russia now is the far more powerful, booming economy of 1.6 billion, rather cramped, Chinese people over the other side that Putin is virtually ignoring whilst they are investing countless billions expanding their armed forces...why do you think that might be?
China is power out of the class. Class for itself. On the pyramid of powers, it is China and then empty space and then coming USA and Russia, then again empty space and, just then western European power.

So, China would anytime soon, become able to deal with any threat (of course, nukes are especial kind of thing).

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
China could crush Russia like a bug if it so wished and Putin would serve his people much better if he focused his attention in that direction, not at Ukraine which is going to join the EU eventually no matter what he does or how many revolutions it takes.
China is old civilization. Meaning,... when building its plans build them for 300 years in advance.

Anyway, China isn`t stupid to even try to crash Russia. If they push Russia too strong, having in mind that is Russia already under pressure by the NATO/EU, Russia could collapse.

But, why would China do this? Russia, as long exist is natural Chinese shield, eternal obstacle to expansion of NATO/EU. It also works in opposite direction. China is Russian shield.

It works because west of Europe and US represent vulgar civilizations. Both, China and Russia are aware of the brutality of the magnates from the west of Europe and US, aware of their genocidal methods. So, neither China, neither Russia can be bribed or seduced to betray each others. They know what would happen to each of them if just west of Europe and US eventually finish with either China or Russia previously. They themselves would be next. its simple as that.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 22:19
GoodLuckUkraine GoodLuckUkraine is offline
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Originally Posted by Gavrilo View Post
west of Europe and US represent vulgar civilizations. Both, China and Russia are aware of the brutality of the magnates from the west of Europe and US, aware of their genocidal methods
Hahahahha oh my God, that is HILARIOUS!

Where the hell do you guys get this fantasy from?

Classic stuff, keep it coming
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 10th August 2014, 23:38
ex-nyer ex-nyer is offline
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Originally Posted by Gavrilo View Post
...Both, China and Russia are aware of the brutality of the magnates from the west of Europe and US, aware of their genocidal methods...
Could you perhaps give an example of what you consider to be the "genocidal methods" of these western "magnates?"

China and the USSR/Russia have, without question, killed more of their own citizens than any other countries or empires in human history, bar none. More, indeed, than Nazi Germany -- many, many more. Anyone who supports the values of these regimes in comparison to western values should die of shame for uttering the word "genocide" as an accusation against others.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 11th August 2014, 00:58
Gavrilo Gavrilo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
Hahahahha oh my God, that is HILARIOUS!

Where the hell do you guys get this fantasy from?

Classic stuff, keep it coming
we all enjoy



Quote:
Originally Posted by ex-nyer View Post
Could you perhaps give an example of what you consider to be the "genocidal methods" of these western "magnates?".
Let me start with three words:

``Drang Nach Osten``

Quote:
Originally Posted by ex-nyer View Post
China and the USSR/Russia have, without question, killed more of their own citizens than any other countries or empires in human history, bar none. More, indeed, than Nazi Germany -- many, many more. Anyone who supports the values of these regimes in comparison to western values should die of shame for uttering the word "genocide" as an accusation against others.
Sure, sure. We all know about Russia. What Russia did and what Russia didn`t.

i know for the Russian sins against its own tribes and other Slavic tribes from the time of era of slavery (what west of Europe- Romans and Teutons, imposed on Slavs). i know for partitions of Poland. i know for late acceptance of Ukrainian nation and Ruthenians, Siberia of Russian Tzars, Zaporozhians, Czechs, Hungary, Gulag-Katyn (ordered by Georgian Stalin but still, ethnic Russians were on terrain), Ukraine (ongoing)... That if we speak about negative things. We can also speak about positive things but, it obviously isn`t topic here.

But, in the same time we all very well knows for the dark examples of western Europe and USA.

Let us name few: ethnic genocide/cultural genocide on Dacians, ethnic genocide/cultural genocide on Gauls, ethnic genocide/cultural genocide on Etrurians, ethnic genocide/cultural genocide on Celts, genocid on Semites, era of slavery on other Whites (Slavs), era of slavery on Blacks (Africans), multiple genocides on Africans, multiple genocides on Slavs, multiple genocides on native Americans (Northern, Central and Southern), cultural genocide on all native Americans (especially destruction of 5000 Aztec books by Spaniards), invention of colonial era, cultural genocide on Lusatian Serbs (ongoing), cultural genocide against other Slavs (bombardments of libraries), WWI, WWII, partitions of Poland, holocaust on Jews, nuclear bombs (ethnic genocide/cultural genocide) on Japan, Vietnam, invasion of Falkland, destruction of Yugoslavia, partition of Serbia, cultural genocide on Balkan Serbs (ongoing), Iraq, Libya, Syria, Ukraine (ongoing),... There are positive things but, we speak of bad ones.

Last edited by Gavrilo; 11th August 2014 at 02:18.
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