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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 24th September 2014, 03:36
MichaelB_PL MichaelB_PL is offline
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Originally Posted by Hannia View Post
[B]Oleh, unfortunately the world revolves around the powers that are. When Ukraine signed the Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances, it gave all its power away. Politically it was naive. Maybe President Kuchma forgot how Ukraine was screwed in the Yalta Agreement? How many times does history need to slap you in the face, before you get the message?
Actually, Ukraine wasn't screwed at Yalta, that's how Ukraine got it's inflated borders, together with Lwów (Lviv) and lots of other land stolen from Poland.

Quote:
He needs to keep reminding America and Great Britain, that they are under great obligation, militarily and otherwise, to Ukraine.
What obligation exactly?

Which point says US/UK have to defend Ukrainian borders?

Ukraine. Memorandum on Security Assurances - Wikisource, the free online library

Point 4:

"The United States of America, the Russian Federation, and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council action to provide assistance to Ukraine, as a non-nuclear-weapon State Party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used."

1. As long Russia plays conventional, there is no obligation.
2. It says they have to seek UN security council action, not that they have to provide assistance themselves.

Russia is breaking this treaty (point 1), but USA and UK are not.
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Old 24th September 2014, 15:31
Davor Davor is offline
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Originally Posted by MichaelB_PL View Post

1. As long Russia plays conventional, there is no obligation.
2. It says they have to seek UN security council action, not that they have to provide assistance themselves.

Russia is breaking this treaty (point 1), but USA and UK are not.

Where is the evidence about Russian military in Ukraina? Western and Kiev's propaganda trumpeting about that but without one single evidence. But thais is a way to excuse their military failures on the front in East Ukraine.

Sending military aid without direct using of armed forces is not aggression. In Bosnian war all three sides received military help from other countries, Bosnian Serbs from Serbia, Bosnian Croats from Croatia, Bosnian muslims from muslim countries.
If there is not direct involvement of foreign armed forces, military aid is not considered as a military involvement. Volunteers don't count.
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Old 24th September 2014, 16:53
Siefert Siefert is offline
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Originally Posted by Davor View Post
Where is the evidence about Russian military in Ukraina? Western and Kiev's propaganda trumpeting about that but without one single evidence. But thais is a way to excuse their military failures on the front in East Ukraine.

Sending military aid without direct using of armed forces is not aggression. In Bosnian war all three sides received military help from other countries, Bosnian Serbs from Serbia, Bosnian Croats from Croatia, Bosnian muslims from muslim countries.
If there is not direct involvement of foreign armed forces, military aid is not considered as a military involvement. Volunteers don't count.
Good point!
And let us remember the US has got satellites watching Russia's every move. No doubt Russia supplied much military equipment and some Russian volunteers (as well as from many other European countries) crossed over to help out, but as of today no proof of Russia's armed forces in Ukraine has been demonstrated.
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Old 25th September 2014, 02:18
Hannia Hannia is offline
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Originally Posted by Siefert View Post
Good point!
And let us remember the US has got satellites watching Russia's every move. No doubt Russia supplied much military equipment and some Russian volunteers (as well as from many other European countries) crossed over to help out, but as of today no proof of Russia's armed forces in Ukraine has been demonstrated.

How did an German speaker, senior in yrs & currently living in Switzerland, have developed something akin to Stockholm syndrome in his relationship to a foreign govt, like Putin's ?
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Old 28th September 2014, 18:57
Hannia Hannia is offline
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Poroshenko Bloc, Radical Party, Batkivschyna, Civil Position to win seats on parliament - poll
26-09-2014 13:43

The Bloc of Petro Poroshenko, Oleh Liashko's Radical Party, the Batkivschyna All-Ukrainian Union and the Civil Position party will win seats in the next Verkhovna Rada, according to a survey conducted by Kyiv International Institute of Sociology (KIIS) at the request of the International Foundation for Electoral Systems (IFES).

KIIS Director General Volodymyr Paniotto said at a press conference on Friday that the public opinion poll was conducted from September 5 to September 13. At the same time, 1,613 respondents were interviewed throughout Ukraine, apart from Donbas. In addition, 361 respondents in Donetsk and Luhansk were interviewed through personal interviews or by phone. According to the survey, among "very likely voters," i.e. those who will come to the polls and decided for whom to vote, 26% will support the Bloc of Petro Poroshenko, 11% the Radical Party, 8% Batkivschyna, and 6% Civil Position. Some 4% of those polled are ready to vote for the Svoboda Party, 8% for other parties, and 36% were undecided. Director of Monitoring, Evaluation and Public Opinion Research at IFES Rakesh Sharma said that the study had been conducted before the announcement that the People's Front Party will participate in the elections, so this political force was not included in the survey results. The study was conducted with financial support from the United States Agency for International Development (USAID). Under the law, the Ukrainian parliament is composed of parties that overcome a five percent electoral threshold.Poroshenko Bloc, Radical Party, Batkivschyna, Civil Position to win seats on parliament - poll < News < Home
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Old 28th September 2014, 19:01
Hannia Hannia is offline
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Poroshenko seeking at least $1 billion for Donbas restoration fund
Ukrainian Journal Staff Report SUNDAY, SEPTEMBER 28, 2014

KIEV, Sept. 25 – President Petro Poroshenko said he hopes that the fund for Donbas restoration will collect at least $1 billion.

"I have no doubts that we'll manage to accumulate at least $1 billion into a special fund for Donbas infrastructure restoration and not just due to funds from the taxpayers of Ukraine," he said at a press conference in Kiev on Thursday.

The president stressed that Donbas infrastructure will be rebuilt due to means of a special state budget fund, and a special non-government fund, which will be enriched by the payments from other countries.
Ukrainian Journal
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Old 28th September 2014, 19:09
Hannia Hannia is offline
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Terrorist-appointed elections won’t be recognized: Poroshenko
Speaking at his press conference Sept. 25, Pres Poroshenko said the early local elections in terrorist-controlled territories of Donbas are to be held within the dates agreed with Kyiv, the monitoring by observers and in compliance to the Ukrainian legislation.

The terrorists have already appointed their elections to be held on Nov. 2, with Kyiv setting the date at Dec. 7.

The elections must be held with the international observers present, with armed people off the streets with the open and unimpeded voting by the residents, Poroshenko said.

Poroshenko stressed that prosecutors, judges and police chiefs in the terrorist-controlled territories of Donbas will be appointed by Kyiv following the approval from the would-be elected local authorities.
Terrorist-appointed elections won’t be recognized Poroshenko
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