Go Back   Ukraine.com Discussion Forum > Society > Politics

Notices


War against ukraine !

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 14th June 2014, 20:03
MichaelB_PL MichaelB_PL is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Poland
Posts: 696
MichaelB_PL is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodLuckUkraine View Post
You're right, I don't understand Ukraine anywhere near as much as I'd like and I've not even heard of S. Bandera (I'll do some reading later) but surely the majority of Ukrainians are decent people and not nasty racists?
I guess that depends on what standards one would use. By my standards, people who consider fascist leaders or war criminals "heroes" are not decent people.

As for Bandera, here's a little introduction - the article might be seem a bit outdated, by actually isn't, as the Maidan revolution is basically a Orange Revolution 2.0.

A Fascist Hero in Democratic Kiev by Timothy Snyder | NYRblog | The New York Review of Books

In short, a large number, probably the majority of western Ukrainians consider fascists from OUN/UPA "heroes" - people who often took part in two genocides - first as German helpers during the Holocaust, then in the OUN/UPA genocide of Polish civilian population. And today Ukrainians from western Ukraine build monuments to them, name streets after them and call them "heroes". They also often conduct something akin to Holocaust denial - they often tend to lie both about their "heroes" part in Holocaust and about the genocide against the Polish population.

BTW the thing which makes this different than neofascists or neonazis from other countries is the scale and the level of support for this. Like in the article I gave link to - in every country there are neofasists, but in Ukraine a neofascist actually became the president.
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 15th June 2014, 04:43
stepanstas stepanstas is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,147
stepanstas is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by @codycoyote37 View Post
Ukrainians grieve, stiffen resolve; IL-76 Crash photos, Map location, SAM speculation: Visit my Twitter: https://twitter.com/codycoyote37
I like your feed, following you now.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 15th June 2014, 04:47
stepanstas stepanstas is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,147
stepanstas is on a distinguished road
Thats enough fascist talk for this thread. Its all been discussed here and can continue to be, but this thread cant be taken off topic.

Poland & Ukraine History
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 15th June 2014, 12:33
GoodLuckUkraine GoodLuckUkraine is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 185
GoodLuckUkraine is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelB_PL View Post
As for Bandera, here's a little introduction - the article might be seem a bit outdated, by actually isn't, as the Maidan revolution is basically a Orange Revolution 2.0.
That's a very interesting and detailed article about a complex past - thanks for sharing. I can fully understand why some Ukrainian people would view Bandera as a national hero whilst conveniently looking the other way when his ethnic cleansing is pointed out.

Anyone who supports Bandera's extremist views about ethnic purity in Ukraine would oppose any association with the EU as EU membership requires open borders and the free movement of goods, services and people - meaning anyone, from anywhere in the EU, will gain the right to walk straight into Ukraine, buy a house, get a job and live happily ever after.

I expect the likes of Bandera would have been blowing people up to prevent EU membership, not camping in the Maidan waving EU flags so perhaps Bandera fans are deliberately selective with their memories of him.
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 16th June 2014, 04:22
Tkach Tkach is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 231
Tkach is on a distinguished road
MichaelB, stop smoking your drugs. It causes delusions.

I read inaccurate statements by you and your friend, GLU, too.

Ukrainians have been influenced by an agenda via the pro-EU/USA crowd and on the other side, the neo-Soviet Putinoids who pretend that 'neo-nazi' boogymen control Ukraine or at least the Western part. So, nationalism in the country is like the worst thing in the world. But, the opposite is true. US/Western groups have taken over the Western part, especially, and the Kremlin has brainwashed the Eastern part to think that they are a 'fascist' coup. Yet, both the supposed 'far-right' parties Svoboda and the more recent, 'Right Sector' have had heavy influence from both American and Jewish (look up their connections to Israel) groups. This is a fascist organization?!? Come on.

But, this is not surprising as even many Ukrainians have not figured this out yet. So, it can't be expected for very many Westerners to recognize it.

One other thing, it was stated that Poland was not as financially/economically backwards. Well, one reason for that is because Germany pumped up their economy more than any other EU country. The data/info is out there.
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 16th June 2014, 08:52
GoodLuckUkraine GoodLuckUkraine is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 185
GoodLuckUkraine is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tkach View Post
...heavy influence from both American and Jewish (look up their connections to Israel) groups. This is a fascist organization?!?
Oh no you're just one of them "everything's a zionist conspiracy" nutters. Now I'm not going to be able to take anything you say seriously.
Reply With Quote
  #21 (permalink)  
Old 16th June 2014, 16:27
sylvestersue sylvestersue is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 50
sylvestersue is on a distinguished road
The longer I live, the more I believe that the ONLY thing that will bring the human race together is if attacked by aliens!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 20:56.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC4 © 2006, Crawlability, Inc.