The greate RUS or why Ukrain's afraid of union with Russia.

[Lina]

I see your point. I can not say that there is no truth in it. So, the answer is corruption, instability, unfriendly laws...I hope it might change some time! Some time soon...
May be a part of the problem is that many young people are trying to do business, but the laws are created by old people who have no idea how to do business! Any thoughts on that?

From another side, one might think, that Ukraine could be a perfect plase to do business in (if the above problems did not exist), because of it's wonderful geographic location, natural resourses, and...relativly cheap labor.
I do not know.

[ILay]

Hello Arkadi,
hello everyone!

First of all I'd like to state that i'm a Russian lving in Russia.

Arkadi

As you could notice, your question on Russia.com attracted only 3 answers. Here it's a bit different so I place my opinion here if you don't mind.

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I do not think any type of union is necessary now. First of all if someone does not want to unite - it's his or her business. Does the majority of Ukrainians want any sort of union? I don't think so (if someone has some URLs on the 'vox populi' statistics concerning this matter, I'd be extremely grateful for posting it).

Any union with Ukraine would cause a lot of problems for Russia. In terms of economics, international affairs etc. Do you want another type of a time bomb for Russia?

It would be much more wise to build up a union with Belorussia, Kazakhstan, Armenia. Any union should be benifitial for both sides. I do not see any benifits from the conjunction with Ukraine. May be the ports?
I don't know; it's better to invest in Novorossiysk and Temryuk, Azov, Rostov, Taganrog, Vyborg.

We can benefit from normal economic relationships so it's better to adopt most favorable nation agreements.
Frankly speaking I prefer to see Ukraine independent and take advantage from cheaper labour force, materials in Ukraine and cheaper and more easy to access money and better business environment in Russia.
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language: I'm not sure that the majority speaks Ukrainian. At least then I visited Ukraine last time I noticed that even on state TV channels it was a common situation that the host asks in Ukrainian and the guest ansers in Russian.
And I remember the high court of Ukraine informational letter on a critical issue - many courts sederunted the decisions in Russian and then translated to Ukrainian so it caused problems in law enforcement, then the court mentioned the sub-clause х which was translated as i. (I could search for the letter if someone is really interested)
May be the situation changed dramatically since I've been to Ukraine last time? Another thing to mention is that other republics somehow managed to keep their languages - Baltic states, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaidjan etc. Do you really think it's correct to blame the Russians for not using your language? In the Soviet times, as far as I remember (I'm quite young though, so maybe 40 years ago Ukrainian language was prohibited?), there was a state TV channel on Ukrainian, each school boy should learn the language (rodnoy yazik, rodnaya literatura) but everybody hated it...
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Btw I could not recall any bombardments of Ukraine done by Russians. I'm not a historian though so maybe someone could enlighten me?
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Just to resume my long message:
if there would be a referendum held in Russia questioning if we would like to make a Union, or Federation or whatever with Ukraine, I, as a taxpayer and citizen, would strongly oppose it.

With best wishes and hoping I did not offend any of the Ukrainian members of the board.

[Irena]

I do want everybody to understand at last.
The Ukrainians and the Russians are the two very different nations.
If a Ukrainian speaks russian language (like me), it doesn't mean that he (she) is russian.
We are defferent by mentalitet, culture, education, mind, character etc.
Many of russians who were born in Ukraine have ukrainian mentalitet, education, mind. They are more mild, more educated, they condemn a war.
But the Russians have a very warlike character. Ask any Russian what he (she) think of the Chechnia War. They will answer: ALL Chechens are terroriste but we are not. But I do think that Russians are terroriste as well.
I don't want to unit with this noncultural and warlike nation. Stephen, do you want? Forward!
Besides, why do you compair Russians and Frenchmen?
Stephen, go to a library!
Russians are not Frenchmen!
Stephen, I repeat you: you understand nothing about Ukraine (I suspect about Serbia, religion also).

[Arkadi_]

Ok, step by step.......
At the risk of losing your respect I will confess.
Am 15 years old.
Wait it gets better!
I live in Toronto(Canada)
I am Russian, I was born in SosnoviyBor 90 km west of ST-Petersburg......
I live In Canada for 2 years now, have a lot of friend's here from all over former USSR.....
I come on theese two cites to get info on whatever is going on....

[Lina]

QUOTE:
"Frankly speaking I prefer to see Ukraine independent and take advantage from cheaper labour force, materials in Ukraine and cheaper and more easy to access money and better business environment in Russia."

To everybody:
I HATE when my own words are mispresented... may be my mistake!
Just to clarify some things...so that there would be no confusion in the future! When I was talking about cheap labour in Ukraine I meant Ukraine more as the area of ex-Soviet country , where the labour is cheap compared to Germany, Britain, France etc. I was also including Russia, Belarus, Moldova, etc...in the list of the cheaper labour countries...where the labour is also cheap compared to the Western Europe.

Sorry, but I really naively thought I was pretty clear.
From this point of view, it would be interesting to see Russia "taking an advantege from the cheaper Ukrainian labour" when they are surrounded by cheap Russian labour themselves! Brilliant business thinking! Well, that can be "the more easy way to access money" for some people. One can only be left to wonder what other "better enviroment for business" Russia has to offer.

[ILay]

Lina

I was not misinterpreting your words, I was sharing my experience. Actually then writing I did not think of any correlations with your post.

WE ARE taking the advantage of cheaper labour in Ukraine. The difference in MY industry is from 1,5 to 3 times comparing the wages in Russia and Ukraine.

We hire the people in Ukraine because there the professional in Russia requests USD 500 per month, same professional in Ukraine is ready to work for USD 300.

We also benifit from the cheaper money in Russia. And lack of orders for Ukrainian companies.

You may like it or not but it's true. I have no intention to argue about it. I already gave my opinion.
brgds.

[Lina]

O.K. I'll assume that you are somewhere from Moscow or S.P.
Then, can you please enlighten me what area are you working in ? so I would not be sitting here in the darkness and may know some examples from life as well...
It'll be nice.

[Edited by Lina on 24th February 2001 at 19:36]