The Selfishness of the USA

[Ukrcossack]

Thanks, Johamatt. I hope Ukraine will have similar taxes in the future. Right now it is the other way around: if you earn less than 5,000USD you get taxed the most and when you earn millions - you are not taxed
Good point, Hannia. And I think euthanasia should be offered for free in that case

[Hannia]

Ukrcossack,

Absolutely not.

Your family should pay for any euthanasia. Why should I pay for it? i am already subsidizing the people that can't afford to pay for health insurance on their own.

No freebie euthanasia. That should also be included in the waiver.

PS> The elimination of tax loopholes for the oligarchy would indeed be a major step toward a working economy in Ukraine. BUT that is a subject for another post.

[stepanstas]

Originally Posted by Hannia

Stepan,

I agree that you should not be forced to buy health insurance, however I do think that in not agreeing to do so, you should be made to sign a legal waiver.

If you get sick, you're on your own, and will be excluded from any govt medicaid whatsoever. If you can't pay for medical treatment, that is your own problem. If you get so sick that you die, too bad. The world is overpopulated as is.

I think that is only fair.

Agreed and I have no problem with that. And I'm sure, as I get older / have a family, that will change, but for now, I'm fine with that.

But see, this is a major consern. Anyone picked up from the street will get their bill sent to them (assuming they have an address). Many of those probably don't pay. I assume that gets passed down to tax payers.

You can't deny them treatment and you can't force them pay. It's a dead end. That's the real problem.

[johamatt]

I think you are wrong; A health reform that gives everyone right to health care is neither communism or socialism. Communism is a social structure in which classes are abolished and property is commonly controlled. Socialism is a political and economic ideology that seeks to create the classless society, where means of production are controlled or owned by the people.
Neither is true for Sweden. We have free healthcare, yes, and I think that is good.

We don’t have to discuss this more. I understand it is difficult for many people to understand that some things in society should be common.

[Hannia]

Johamatt,

Our friend Stepan is young and thinks himself immortal. I hope he never has to deal w/the wake call of cancer or some other disease that strikes at any age.
________________________________

Stepan,

The people on the streets are lost souls. It is our obligation to care for them as we have been doing all along. They are not part of the mix we are discussing. It is highly likely that they don't even know that a health plan has been passed. They don't even care. They are probably more concerned about the rain today and keeping their bodies warm.

[stepanstas]

johamatt,

Again, this doesn't give anyone right to care. Everyone has right to care.

Originally Posted by Hannia

Johamatt,

Our friend Stepan is young and thinks himself immortal. I hope he never has to deal w/the wake call of cancer or some other disease that strikes at any age.
________________________________

Stepan,

The people on the streets are lost souls. It is our obligation to care for them as we have been doing all along. They are not part of the mix we are discussing. It is highly likely that they don't even know that a health plan has been passed. They don't even care. They are probably more concerned about the rain today and keeping their bodies warm.

Thanks Hannia, I hope so too.

I want to expand this to people who are on aid and etc and don't get jobs and etc. But this topic is geting to wide, so we'll just keep it as is.

[Hannia]

Stepan,

Don't buy into the exaggerated numbers of those on welfare rolls. Do your own research and you are very apt to be surprised. Make sure to look at these stats before the economic crises, as the figures now are somewhat distorted by current conditions.