How can I verify the identity of a woman in Odessa?

[armadillo]

Hi Guys

I'm a new member and this is my first post, so Hi to all!

I'll be totally upfront and tell you I join this forum right now to get help as I'm really stuck...!

I'm in the process of trying to figure out a lady (She's either an absolute angel or a very clever and crafty devil, I can't be sure right now) and would greatly appreciate answers from those who know more than myself in order to help me certainly figure her out one way or the other.

A synopsis of events thus far:

Woman, 25years old, has daughter of 5 years, lives in Odessa, works as a hairstylist. Have exchanged 14 emails in 4 weeks - I know the emails come from Odessa (Odessa is detailed in the server info in the email header) so her city location appears true.
She doesn't have a home phone ('still waiting for it to be installed') and borrowed a friend's mobile phone recently so I could call her. We spoke for 25 minutes, but she was struggling to make a sentence in English, her English seems genuinely poor and broken, else she's absolutely brilliant at pretending it is. Even so, she was sweet, fun and polite and seemingly genuine and very well humoured. Before the phone call, I indicated an interest in visiting her in December.
After the phone call, she appears to panic that her English is so useless that she won't be able to communicate with me if I visit her in December and dives into the idea of taking fast track English lessons with a one on one tutor to learn as much as possible in the time. She quotes $12/hour for the lessons. That would be very cheap here but I feel this is probably too expensive in Ukraine? She did not directly ask or demand any money but surely suggested I help her pay for them. This is where my trust in her started to slide. Carefully I replied I was not able to help her pay for one to one lessons suggested self-study with my help on the phone.

She tells me our correspondence is translated by an interpreter, and has asked me to help her - yeah you got it, in the next (latest) email she's asking me to send some money, US$200 (A big read flag) to help out with the fees, so she can spend that money on English lessons rather than translating our emails (in both directions), which would mean about 8 emails per week which must be 1000+ words long. Having done the sums and a little research, $200 is seems even quite cheap for a human translation for approx 32,000 words in Ukraine. Would this be a realistic figure? (I'm going to suggest she write to me in Russian and I translate it both ways here with a program.) The question is - is she really paying for translations, or fluent in English and trying to get some free money? It really could be either, and it's practically impossible for me to prove her angel or devil. I know people in Ukraine don't usually have money to pay for frequent translations and it gives some credence to her asking for help (which she says she hates to do)

She gives very fast replies which seem to be custom written, although I did find a few lines in her first second and third emails that are word for word duped from online profiles. (Another big red flag to my mind!) either that or someone else duped hers... I can't find anything duped since email 4.
Whilst I find this bothersome, I have myself in the past used common text in early stages of correspondence to save the writing of the same basic information over and over - although it's of my own writing - and I'm not a scammer or rip-off merchant of any kind...

As for photos - she has sent many of them, including some of her as a teenager, which I felt was a good idea as it helps to prove that her photographic identity at least is real, in being of the same person. (A photo thief wouldnt have an archive going back 10+ years.. ) Some of her photos include her 5yo daughter - would a scammer go as far as to include their innocent kid in such?? I asked for some photos seen in the background (on the fridge) of another photo, and surely got them with the next email. In another photo she is looking at photos of me I have sent to her in the last week or so.. So I've concluded the photos are all her own, and I am indeed writing with the girl in the photos, (or at least someone who knows her! arghh!).

Everything else about her correspondence seems genuine without continuity errors or anomaly. She doesn't go overboard with repeatedly stating 'I love you' or anythig like that - infact she hasn't said that once. She does get a little 'flowery' and romantic here and there, and looks 'to the future we might have together' usually in each email. She answers all questions asked of her, and if I miss answering one of hers - she surely reminds me to answer it! (I haven't given away any valuable personal info)
I ask myself, would a scammer bother to even notice or realise I didn't answer all of their questions, or seem a little upset that I didn't comment on some photos sent?

As you can see some stuff here makes me think she is OK and other things arouse suspicion.. and how to prove she is straight or crooked is my dilemma...

If there's anyone in the Odessa region who could perhaps help me confirm her identity - and if she's genuine, help prove her so, it would be amazingly helpful - it would be so cruel to drop her if shes not a crook as she really does seem to be very fond of me. And of course if shes a crook, I want rid of her!

Thanks to anyone who has read this post, I know it's long.

Sensibly objective comments welcome, as is any practical help from Odessians in particular.

armadillo

[El_Diablo_Negro]

First question: What is your age??
Second question: How did you meet her?

There's a reason why I ask these questions trust me. I'm no expert but I can tell you scammers are very clever. I spent the past 6 months writing to someone. I say someone because I have no idea who she was. I now doubt she gave her real name, and it wouldn't surprise me if she was in on the scam. She never asked me for a dime but since I was going through an agency I did lose some money. What I would do is have your letters translated into Ukrainian or Russian or whatever and send that. That way you at least know where your cash is going. As for paying for english lessons.... If I met with a woman I wouldn't want a translator hanging around, but if I didn't speak the language it would make things more difficult. $12 bucks an hour is cheaper than I've seen advertised elsewhere. She answers your questions and seems to expect answers to hers. I can tell you that's more than I got in 6 months of writing!

I would advise you to read as much about this whole process as possible. It gets confusing but at least you get an idea of the process.

[armadillo]

I'm 37 and I found her on a dating site. She was not a paid member, but a 'trial' and since writing to me the profile has been deleted. She may have deleted it herself to show her monogamous interest if she is genuine, or it may have been deleted by the dating site due to complaints, or because she left contact information in the profile. I emailed the dating site and asked about how the profile vanished but unfortunately, I did not get a reply from them. I have not asked her about the disappearance of her profile, but she seemed keen to ensure I was monogamous and that I writing only to her. She really struggled on the phone to to find out if she was the only girl I was writing to/interested in - and seemed happy when I told her she was. See, again could be genuine, and I'd really really like that to be so. But could also have been well faked, and have the purpose of 'I've got my hooks in this guy, lets see what I can squeeze out of him'. It's just SO hard to tell! I have not noticed her on any published blacklists, but I'm sure many scammers aren't on those lists, especially the smaller time ones.
I hate to hold someone who might be totally genuine under suspicion, but when you know what goes on all too often, you have to be very suspicious when someone asks for what might well be genuine assistance, until they can prove themselves totally genuine, or until you can prove them genuine somehow..

I think I'm just going to have to confront her and say she must prove her identity, thoroughly, if we are to continue.

armadillo

[armadillo]

In specific answer to your message, El_Diablo_Negro...

Yes, I bet the scammers are very clever, but luckily, I was born smart also. I do all I can not to step into bad territory, although even the best of us can be tricked of course.
It sounds like, if nothing else, I'm getting more plasible correspondence than you did. Did your contact ignore your questions, answer them badly or with closed answers? Where abouts was she supposed to be writing to you from?
Was the agency an international dating site, or a specifically Russian ladies site? If you look on the web, there are plenty of reccomendations for good ones and lists of bad ones. The thing is.. who is writing these lists??!!
Ohhh its a big headache, if only people were honest...

I am going to get a program to translate correspondence. (Does penty of languages, so it'll never be a waste of money!) If she pushes that idea back and tries to swing back to a monetary agenda, I think she's going to bowl herself out for good, as it doesn't matter by who or how letters get translated, if her genuine desire is truly to be my correspondent with a view to a very real chance of a happy future together.

armadillo

[El_Diablo_Negro]

I asked about your age because I think some guys aren't realistic when they start looking for a wife. From what I've read 10 to 15 years difference is about as far as you can go, any more than that and your odds of being scammed go up. Also they say that dating sites are have more scammers.

The "lady" I was writing answered some of my questions but ignored most of them. It was my first time writing someone so at first I wondered if what I was saying was getting lost in translation. The agency I used only operates in Ukraine, and the "lady" was supposedly from Zhytomyr.

I think translating your letters to her is a very good idea. If I decide to try this again I may invest in something similar. You might want to rethink that confrontational tactic, from what I've read these ladies are very easily offended. She may not be a scammer but will tell you to get lost just because. Good Luck!

[Edited by El_Diablo_Negro on 22nd October 2005 at 20:50]

[q22]

I think $12/hour is to expensive for private lessons,
i had different people working for me i Kiev,
i paid from $3 to $8 pr. hour! for different assistents/interpretors, (and i am a foreigner)
If i am correct the average monthly income is around $150

[kevinsky18]

I'm wondering what ever became of your suspicions?