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Ukrainian women and infedelity

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Old 8th August 2002, 08:17
stigharaldsson stigharaldsson is offline
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I spent about 2 months travelling around Ukraine. I spent most of my time in the east (Donbass, Poltava and Kharkov) and sometime in Odessa as well as in Kiev. I met plenty of women from various ages during my trip (I'm going on 20 myself). I came to Ukraine thinking that the Ukrainian women are hard-working, educated and conservative house-wifes at the same time as the men are drunks who cheat all the time and leave their wifes alone with the kid(s) at the age of 25. Having spent so much time in Ukraine myself, I can say real life told me different.

Yes, the women are highly educated (but in fact all people in Ukraine seem to have a doctor's degree...even the old man you see sleeping behind the trashbins) but in many cases it doesn't mean much, since you can easily bribe your way around at the universities.

It's not the Ukrainian women themselves that are very conservative, it's the society since it's extremely sexist. It seems it's standard procedure for the boss to take the female applicant out for dinner and **** her before he decides if she's good for the job or not. The gender roles are very obvious in all sences and the Ukrainian girls dress really sexy only because they use their bodies as a way of getting around in the society.

But the main surprise to me was is how the Ukrainian women regard infedelity. I can't count the times I went out with girls who wanted a little on the side even though they were married or allready had boyfriend(s). They were all very cool and upfront about it as if cheating was a natural thing. She was "together with some old guy because he was wealthy/her husband wasn't treating her good/she was going to get a divorce soon anway/her boyfriend was out of town so it was ok for her to be with me". I was often out trolling with my friend, looking for women to chat up. And it came to the point where we no longer backed away from women with rings...since we by then had come to realize marriage didn't mean much. I also met many foregin students (mainly African and Arab) who cheated on their Ukrainian girlfriends all the time, but for some reason the girls ignored it and let it go. It seemed as if they had a large acceptance of infedelity, but only because they were doing the same thing themselves.

As a conclusion one might say that the high divorce-rates in Ukraine isn't just the fault of the men, because the women are just as bad.

The Ukrainain women are indeed beautiful (atleast before they hit 35) and upfront they seem to have pretty sound and realistic values. But this thing about cheating really scares me. I would definatly think twice before I married a Ukrainian woman who took me because I'm a rich foreginer (which we all are since most people I met made about 25-60 US $ a month). The women are conservative in the sence that they come from a sexist country, but not in how they regard relationships outside marriage. I guess it would be different if she genuinly loved you and genuinly felt attracted to you..but all you 50-year old fat americans, how big do you think your chances are? And even the best marriage has it's flauds, it can't be perfect all the time. I once asked a pretty 17-year old girl in Poltava "If you were married and you had a fight with your husband...would you consider being intimate with another man if he oppurtunity arouse?". She didn't take long and looked at me if I had asked her something obvious and said "Yeah, why not?". The surprise here was that she was so upfront about it.

Anyway, this is just my five cents on Ukraine and it's culture. I only spent 2 months there so I can't say my words are law. I'm sure there are plenty of exceptions and women with different views on fidelity. I'm just saying, in general (both male and female) Ukrainians have a very relaxed view on adultery.

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Old 9th August 2002, 06:58
holland holland is offline
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Have you been to France?
Yours truly!
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Old 9th August 2002, 07:18
Rajkumar Rajkumar is offline
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Stigharaldssoon I believe what you have just said and the same picture was painted about Ukrainain females by Allaturca.He also spent quite some time in Ukraine just like you.The impression I get from both of you is that there seemed to be a high incidence of adultery in Ukraine compared to any other countries and the women in Ukraine seemed to have very poor morals.Besides Allaturca who is from Turkey further adds that there are alot of Ukrainian females in Turkey involved in prostitution.I have met many female foreigners from all over the world and I find generally the famales I have met have carried themselves well and live up to their morals and integerity.Unfortunately I have not come in contact with any Ukrainain females while being abroad or even in my country Malaysia and it I just find it hard to believe but the general impression about Ukrainian females I am afraid has been the same as yours.But again since my participation in ukraine.com I have a very high opinion of those Ukrainian females who have participated here and through their posts here I they have impressed me as females of great integerity,self-respect and character and I am proud to be their friends.But again most of the females here in Ukraine.com are Ukrainians who have settled in other countries and they have within themselves a strong Ukraine culture and family ties and they are proud to be a Ukrainian.I have had the impression that the Ukrainian people are a conservative society and yet these things are quite rampant in their country.I can't understand it Stigharaldsson and if one has to blame it on poverty it just doesn't seem to fit.Besides what has poverty to do with adultery when we are talking about a conservative society with high moral,character and integerity.If that is the case than marriage diesn't seem to make any sense at all if adultery is so high in this society.if that is so then the people of Ukraine believe in free sex and to them there is no guilt whatsoever.I wish you Stigharldsson could tell me why is adultery so high in Ukraine and if it is a conservative society then why are the females of Ukraine not living up to their standards.Is it because Ukrainian women have lost the respect from the Ukrainan men or is it that the Ukrainian men do not know how to respect women as such?
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Old 9th August 2002, 12:47
Kaizer Kaizer is offline
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Hi There,

One thing stigharaldsson got right. There is exceptions. The exception is the woman that he describe. Reading your letter I dont understand one thing. What is the reason for you and your friend to go there?. Ukraine is not on the top ten list for tourist hotspots, so why go there.Who has told you that it's standard procedure for the boss to take the female applicant out for dinner and **** her before he decides if she's good for the job or not. Maybe one person told you this and now it goes for all of them? Ukrainian girls dress really sexy because they are still woman unlike here in the west.

About the 17-year old girl in Poltava, strange conversations you are having. Is it normal for you to talk about this kind of things. When I was down there I really was interested about the people and their country and not about sex.

Age does not make a woman beautiful. Beauty comes from a persons hart. Did it ever occur to you that the divorce rate in the Ukraine is so high thanks to the economic situation.

I know a lot of woman that are highly educated and guess what there papers is for real. They have top jobs here in Europe.

I dont know who you have met down there but it is certainly not the same people I have met there. The people I have met does not fit the description in your letter. Maybe you must watch who you mix with.

If you want to give a realistic opinion about the situation, leave all your money at home and go and live there for a year. Live like they have to, and you might come back on what you are saying. If you always lived in luxury I dont think you will last one year there. I know that I wont.
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Old 9th August 2002, 21:39
SweetNovember SweetNovember is offline
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Stigharaldsson - thank you for saying it outloud. As a Ukrainian woman living in Ukraine I can say - YOU SPEAK THE TRUTH!

Yes, there is nothing surprising you have the boss **** you if you want to achive something. As a Ukrainian woman you have to take up so much sexual harrassment it makes you puke. Women who live by the rules of this society come to think sex and beauty is something you sell - for a chance of better life, better job, better living situation, etc. No wonder they rarely enjoy it. Those who do learn to enjoy it, learn to do so on the side. Sadly, I don't have a single (!) friend who enjoys sex in marriage. They all have lovers, friends, etc. Almost all have done it to get certaint things in life. Although all my friends are educted and professional, I'd say educated women are less prone to sleep around - they are simply more prone to be frigid because of strict "rules" imposed by the literatti culture.

Raj, I understand your warm feelings toward Ukrainians posting here, but let us face it, this is not a society with high moral, character and integerity. People here, both men and women, are brought up to steal, cheat and manupulate. In fact, the is not even an equivalent translation for "integrity" in either Ukrainian or Russian. Speaking of morals, maybe some 70 years ago, before all the soviet crap was dumped on the country - maybe, but not now.

And, no divorce rates have nothing to do with the economic situation. A young girl feels she needs to get married by 23. She marries the first jerk to take her, they live together for 3-5 years until either of them matures and dumps the other.

Kaizer - The women who have top jobs in Europe and Ukraine refused to live with this culture. You should not compare apples and oranges.
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Old 12th August 2002, 06:46
Rajkumar Rajkumar is offline
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I am proud to note that at least SweetNovember upholds the basic qualities of a woman that is self-respect,integerity and character.Tell me something SweetNovember if poverty had nothing to do with the declining moral standards of the Ukrainian women then it is right to say that the suppression during the Russian regime could be a reason for the declining moral standards of the Ukrainian women today.Since they are now liberated there is a freedom of what these Ukrainian women feel that is modernisation and this has led them to shed the conservative beliefs and indulge in freedom of sex.Would agree with me SweetNovember? Let me explain to you more clearly.When I was studying in India I was shocked to see how the muslim girls coming from conservative and strict muslim countries behaved.They were so free and behaved liked wild animals.Of course SweetNovember they could not do the same things which they did in India back in their country because of the strict Islamic rules and thet were sort of surpressed in their country.Just imagine these muslim girls studying in India from such extremist countries with strict Islamic laws indulging in sex,alcohol and drugs.Why? Merely because they were surpressed in their contry and they had strict Islamic guidelines on morals,behaviour and even the dress code.When society has been surpressed for whatever reason whether it be religion or a regime and when freedom is given to them they are liberated from this supression and this leads them to overindulgence in anything which they have been surpressed while losing their moral values integerity and character.This to them is modernisation and freedom of sex.Sad to say in this process they lose their conservative beliefs.Tell me something aren't the people of Ukraine religious or God fearing.What religion do they practise? What is the level of spiritualism among the people of Ukraine.At one time in the U.S.A there was also was such a thing as declining moral values among the women as well as men but today spiritualism has changed all this among the people of USA and I dare to say that sex has taken a different turn all together in USA and I suppose it is done with a level of commitment and a more sacred way and it is no more a freedom of sex attitude by the people of USA.While Europe and USA heads in this direction with declining adultery the Muslim nations have a high incidence of adultery due to their supression by the strict religious teachings and enforcement.
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Old 12th August 2002, 07:45
Laryska Laryska is offline
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SweetNovember... you have it right. Ukraine is still stuck in Soviet mentality on the most part, and that is why people still lie and cheat and steal etc.
This is one thing that saddens me as a Ukrainian. We as a people cannot get past what has happened to our beautiful country. We were so brain washed by the Soviet system, it seems we will never get past this.
The issue of the women having sex with their bosses in order to get on top of the seniority ladder is something that not only happens in Europe, but I am sure it is going on in North America as well. Many people in society treat themselves as objects, and will do anything they can for power and money. The people who do this have no class, no culture, no morals...etc. It's sad, but this is reality. I truely hope that in the end, the survivial of the fittest, of those who have culture, class, morals, will out rule those that cheat and lie.
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