Ukraine nationalism

[nickcsadler]

Does it really matter which side murdered the most??.. or does it bring a warm glow to your heart knowing your side maybemurdered more than the other??.. War is ALWAYS full of atrocities..there is no such thing as a nice clean war.. so let`s not argue about the past instead why not try to agree on the future???

[BlueandGold]

The Nazis had their trial. The Communists are next.

[BlueandGold]

If the communists, as a political party, don't go to international
trial for crimes against humanity, than the world may accept
their ideology of government oppression upon the individual and the
murder of millions of INNOCENT people as a justified act of government authority.

The Red army murdered millions, again I say, MILLIONS of INNOCENT people,
mostly UKRAINIANS, BEFORE and AFTER WWI and WWII.

The UPA fought against this Red horror. And fought the Nazis too.
In other words, the UPA fought against foreign tyranny.

Ukraine doesn't forget.
Just look at Ukraine's national soccer team's uniform.
Their choice of colour is beautiful!

Any individual or nation who cares about any form of truth and justice will
look into Ukraine's history more closely and disregard any attempt of historical revisionism.

Lest we all forget the meaning of freedom.

The Armed Forces of Ukraine today, as in the past, represent the defenders of the free nation of Ukraine.
A democratic nation with good military officers and soldiers sworn to defend a free Ukraine from foreign oppression and occupation.

The red flag you use, even in black and white, is a monstrous symbol. Not of liberty. But of tyranny. It represents the horror of Moscow's government oppression upon Ukrainians and other European nations.

Nonetheless, you are allowed to use it in the same freedom today as what the UPA fought so bravely for in the past.

For a free society.

A democracy for Ukraine. Not ruled by a political ideology.
But governed by a Constitution. For ALL citizens.

Show your horrible pictures too. You have freedom.

The true liberators, the free men and women of the past and of today,
have given you this human right.

[Edited by BlueandGold on 16th June 2005 at 23:30]

[BlueandGold]

To secure and promote individual Rights and Freedoms for ALL citizens.

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by BlueandGold
....
The UPA fought against this Red horror. And fought the Nazis too.

Ukraine doesn't forget.
.....
[Edited by BlueandGold on 16th June 2005 at 22:49]

Hi Nickolas.
We can not choose times we are destined to live in.
"May you live in interesting times" -the Chinese use to say. Yes, we live in interesting times now thank God.
Our (grand)parents lived in horrible times. This sad thing alone can not be full justification for errors they might make.
Yet, such terrible times are crucible for the highest human heights or lowest human lows.
Let us ponder situation of a young Ukrainian facing a terrible dilemna. He just got a letter from a clandestine organization, sounding like a conscription order.
What to do? Fight for freedom is a noble thing but they made it duty santioned with possible death sentence.
Finally he makes dramatic decision - I will try and see.
Then, shortly afterwards, he is sent to kill his neighbour who happened to be of different nationality.
Dilemna again! What should I do?
They say - you have RIGHT to make your soil clean of historic opressors. Ok, but they do add - use your right or we use our right clean the weak, hesisting elements.
He understands all too well what it means.

If he decided to be killed - there was no greter human sacrifice. If he killed once, he will kill again.
Thousands of such decisions were made in Western Ukraine during WWII. It is hard to say how dramatic they had to be.
Now, sixty two years after the Red Nights it is all explained so easily. The UPA conscripts are to be remembered as freedom fighters who fought against two evils. Direct neighbours were almost forgotten in this drama is if they not populated fertile Ukrainian planes for centuries.
All this problem is such a bitter remembrance of history of Ukraine. The Cossacks, the haidamakas, the wild eumenides bringing pogroms. They were all vicims of hard oppresion , no doubt. Yet, they were also stained with so much innocent blood...
I wish Ukraine peace and good historic remembrance, according to her Christian roots.

[BlueandGold]

Zbyszek,

Hello! It's good to read your posts again.
We can not choose times we are destined to live in,
but in freedom and independence, individuals and nations can choose their destiny.

Nevertheless, we need to be thankful for the blessings we have and pray for forgiveness.

[BlueandGold]

We need to help each other and our friends.
In peace and trade.