This is your Ukrainian nationalism

[Max_the_Highlander]

I just want to say West of Ukraine never felt zoological hate to Polish people or to Russians or to any other nations...
Its not matter who have wrote this book.Frankly,I never read it...We have a lot of open discissions in Ukraine about UPA and its role during WW2.Now the whole position of society is we should be liberal to own hystory.Thats the time for forgiveness and love...
I can understand Ukrainian groups in Canada as stalwarts of Bandera or melnicovtsi can have extremal positions.Thats their right.This is ideology of closed groups and its not the ideology of whole the really existing Ukraine or Ukrainians...
Factually phrase "This is your Ukrainian nationalism" can be adressed just to 4-5 Western regions...it cant be adressed to Kiev,to central Ukraine and especially to East and Crimea.
But honestly ,Im not sure Ukrainian nationalism exist at all...anywhere.Im sure it exist just love to own culture and traditions.

[Edited by Max_the_Highlander on 16th November 2005 at 17:27]

[Max_the_Highlander]

Excuse me,Zbyszek...Now I see the gap.Really first tread was printed by Russian guy.Using the expession "Polish article" was not correct.A little misunderstanding...The beginning of this topic is very tangled.I will remember your wish.
But talking honestly ,the same figure of Polishchuk is not understandable for me...

[MiguelMichael]

Max if you meant Polishchuk-he is Ukrainian not Polish.you may say nationalists are strong only in some regions but when they demonstrated in Kiev only russophile communists and socialdemocrats protested.and normally they aren't much better than nationalists.that's not cool political scene in Ukraine is divided into 2 extremist blocs-nationalists who worship Bandera and russophiles.

[Max_the_Highlander]

Talking honestly,Im not nationalist at all...But I live at Western Ukraine and not oncely contacted this phenomen...Every normal guy at West had "patriotical" period...and got back as usually.My expirience sais its not so agressive and terrible thing as it described in first thread.I'd say its just right and ultra-right wing of Ukrainian politics.Additionaly nationalists are real indicator of democracy...if power moves not in the righ side,they begin to shout.
In Ukraine officially registered some political parties of this color as UNA-UNSO,Rukh,CUN,etc...They have reputation of right anti-communist's parties ,popular mostly on the West...
But nationalism is political position and its not supported by all Ukrainians on the West...in our region it has a few of fans,in Galichina many...It depends of the taste.
In USA for example as I know a lot of people who has patriotic position, lift on every morning the national flag and sing the national anthem.Frankly,I dont know anyone in Ukraine doing this...But if the group of people moves with a few of Ukrainian flags the streets of Lviv...we got the label "nationalists".
As about doubtful "feats" of UPA during the war...German Army and Soviet Army sheded much bigger quantity of human blood.Even the unbridled communists dont low themselves to savour deatails of this.And thats surprising why this book was wrote by Ukrainian...

[benda]

Mr. Zbyszek, I've read what you said to the Highlander...

If you really think no Ukrainians spread anti-Ukrainian propaganda you are very wrong (said generally).

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by benda
Mr. Zbyszek, I've read what you said to the Highlander...

If you really think no Ukrainians spread anti-Ukrainian propaganda you are very wrong (said generally).

Benda I REALLY do not think like what you imply and I said what I said really specifically.
I have no reason to think that Dr Polishchuk is anti-Ukrainian. I do trust him.
I do know for sure that the UPA subject is a bone of contention within Ukrainian society and I only think that many Ukrainians both outside and inside Ukraine had not enough reliable knowledge concerning this subject.
I have a few Ukrainian friends and there are serious differences on the UPA among them.
Poland is now in danger of a rising nationalist wave after our last parliamentary and presidential elections. I do worry about it, too.
There can be good and bad childrens' love.
There is conceited and boastful love and there is other love which keeps no score of wrongs, does not gloat over other man's sins and knows no limit of faith, hope and endurance. First one is called nationalism and the other is called patriotism.
As to Highlander, I wish him the best and I hope he will find this place hospitable. Welcome to the board Max!

[benda]

I understand that very well and that is why I wrote '(said generally)'.

I cannot say anything because I haven't read Polishchuk's book.