"Harvest of Despair" -- documentary

[safar]

Hi All,

I don't know too much about Ukrainian history just what I have read in guide books. But recently I saw a documentary on (WYBE - Philadelphia, USA) called Harvest of Despair. It was about state engineered famine in Ukraine by the Soviets. It claims that well over 7 million Ukrainians died from starvation enforced by Moscow?

Has anyone else seen this documentary? is this an exageration? as it seems to be one the biggest holocaust but its rarely talked about.

thanks

[safar]

I found this documentary surprising. It was a very believable documentary, here is a link to it:

http://www.infoukes.com/history/fami...st_of_despair/

I asked the person I know in Ukraine about this on email and she said (in her broken English) that it is not only abstract history for her because her 84 year old grandmother has vivid memories of what hapenned during those times.

However the numbers of people who died seems too high. I would like hear some opposing views.

[Freedom1]

Recently had the opportunity to meet an uncle whom I've never met. Age 80. He and my dad ( born 1924 and 1927 respectively) grew up together near L'viv.

Good Lord what an existance. Imagine working the better part of a day for an egg. Better than his father who only worked for booze apparently.

After hearing his racontes of their childhood, I completely understood why my father never wanted to return to the Ukraine. Effing hell it was. Probalby akin to many third world spots today.

[Ulysses]

There is so much garbage written on the subject. Interestingly enough, the strongest denials (even to this day) seem to be from "historians" in the UK/Canada/US.

On the subject, of the press...Is it any surprise that after decades they still haven't gotten their act together?

Originally posted by Dr_Watson
[B]It's not politically correct to admit that it happened because so many Western lefties denied it.

[NZman]

Hi Watty,

Except Eddy Merckx

You're spot about the left the - friends of the west haters - SWP make a point of this.

One big problem is that when the famine is questioned hit's come from all side... The Polyaks aways bring up the UPA and the First Division so you have to spend most of you time deflecting that.


Koba the Dread makes many good points on this subject.

Data points to 6-7 million, but migration also plays a part.

Love the NZman

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by NZman
One big problem is that when the famine is questioned hit's come from all side... The Polyaks aways bring up the UPA and the First Division so you have to spend most of you time deflecting that.
Love the NZman

NZman, Poles inhabiting Western Ukraine before WWII did not know much about the subject but, in spite of closely watched Polish - Soviet border, they knew enough to be sure that the Holod is a terrifying and undeniable fact. The UPA issue has nothing to do with the engineered famine. Western Ukraine was a poor land but people did not die of hunger there under Polish administration. The UPA was criticized both by Russians, Jews, Czechs and Polish. The fact that no UPA equivalent was invented in Eastern Ukraine in spite of much more desperate situation of Ukrainians only shows how deep was the gap between mentality of the West and the East of Ukraine.

[NZman]

Hi Watty,

You're right, Amis ain't much of as a historian, but his book is referenced well and ain't too bad of a place to start.

I'm a Kiwi mate the old fella's a Serb. We're all fans of Rugby League in my clan, but the old Cheese and her family have a thing for Glasgow Ranger - For me I'd almost prefer to watch rugby union that bother with 'football- as you'd call it

BTW - Red Stars problems started with Arkan, but that as they say, is another story

Love the NZman