Re Kyivan Rus

[yurilev0]

By the way, we're having a discussion over in personals re Kyivan Rus and who is the proper heir to the empire, Ukraine or Russia. Since we kind of got off the topic over there is there anyway we can either bring the discussion here or perhaps have some of you history fans come over there?

Yuri

[V-G]

here is the link to "there"

http://www.ukraine.com/forums/showth...?threadid=5419


Yeh, it is off the topic, but nevertheless, it's getting more and more interesting .

[mishaaverko]

Here are some related links:

IS UKRAINE REALLY UKRAINE

http://www.ukraine.com/forums/showth...3?threadid=855

HISTORY OF THE UKRAINIAN LANGUAGE

http://www.ukraine.com/forums/showth...?threadid=4486

[mishaaverko]

Czechs, Slovaks, Jews, Russians, east Ukrainians and most Belarussians use the "sky" ending to last names as opposed to "ski."

Poland was never part of the Kievan Rus legacy (9th to mid 13th century) and never shared the same Christian denomination and language with any of the people comprising Kievan Rus.

Poland later intervened as an agressor.

Later with Polish chauvinist revisionism.

Did anyone see the movie WestWorld (circa 19 seventies) starring Yul Bryner who played a Cowboy robot (he kept getting the crap knocked out of him, only to come back for more)? Prawda is just like that character. In a twisted way, there's some nobleness to such continued defense of one's stupidity.

[Halina]

Originally posted by mishaaverko
Czechs, Slovaks, Jews, Russians, east Ukrainians and most Belarussians use the "sky" ending to last names as opposed to "ski."

Poland was never part of the Kievan Rus legacy (9th to mid 13th century) and never shared the same Christian denomination and language with any of the people comprising Kievan Rus.

Poland later intervened as an agressor.

Later with Polish chauvinist revisionism.

Did anyone see the movie WestWorld (circa 19 seventies) starring Yul Bryner who played a Cowboy robot (he kept getting the crap knocked out of him, only to come back for more)? Prawda is just like that character. In a twisted way, there's some nobleness to such continued defense of one's stupidity.

And?.. What is your point?
The argument about the 'sky' ending as opposed to 'ski' is totally irrelevant. What are you talking about, mishaverko?

Please, mind your language. I am afraid that repetition is very much your cup of tea and curiously enough, you seem to repeat not just words but the whole sentences and phrases formed in exactly the same way. You do it on regular basis, like a robot... Consider some paraphrasing, no? Otherwise, you could just cut and paste your own posts and the final result would be exactly the same. 'Polish chauvinist' you've written about 28 times by now - I've counted!! It is hilarious!

[Zbyszek]

Originally posted by mishaaverko

1.Czechs, Slovaks, Jews, Russians, east Ukrainians and most Belarussians use the "sky" ending to last names as opposed to "ski."

2.Poland was never part of the Kievan Rus legacy (9th to mid 13th century) and never shared the same Christian denomination and language with any of the people comprising Kievan Rus.

3.Poland later intervened as an agressor.

4.Later with Polish chauvinist revisionism.

5.Did anyone see the movie WestWorld (circa 19 seventies) starring Yul Bryner who played a Cowboy robot (he kept getting the crap knocked out of him, only to come back for more)? Prawda is just like that character. In a twisted way, there's some nobleness to such continued defense of one's stupidity.

V-G, now you have a full display of Misha's discussion which is off topic repetion of his endless quotes. Misha when the hell are you going to explain about "moving [Rus] capital north" and about the Trident[Tryzub] symbol?

Remember (if you can): Ivan the Terrible died in 1584 and not in 1538. Are you going to argue this as well?

1. As Halina noted, it is totally irrelevant and erroneous. Names which we use now, have been functioning for only about five hundred years. -ski is just an adjective form in all Slavic languages and you should know it. Your interpretation is typically American. There was nothing like opposition of -sky against -ski in the Slavic lands.

2. Who of us ever claimed the otherwise? Of course Misha overlooked the fact that the Eastern Church Schism occurred after Poland or Rus were christened so that was ONE common Christian denomination in the Xth century. The Schism of 1054 has not been practically noticed in Poland and Rus in the XIth and even in the XIIth century.
There was a good balance between poland and Rus in spite of occasional fights (along with many internal fights in both countries involving some foreign help). This balance was lost due to the Tartar invasion which weakend and demoralized Kievan rulers.

3. Poland received Rus/Ukraine as a troublesome "gift" from Lithuania in 1569, without any fight. Misha, quote any aggresive XVIth cent. Poland's intervention wars against Rus/Ukraine if you can!
The only remarkable war I can remember was about Galicia in about 1347; Galicia has been small and disputed area for centuries.

4. No comment.

5. Maybe, I have not seen it.

Misha, this thread is about Kyivan Rus. Be so kind and prove your theories at last!
Zhuk and Kathy know a lot about Rus and I hope they will help me and you Misha.

[Edited by Zbyszek on 25th March 2003 at 13:56]

[zhuk]

By the way, my family is Zhukovsky, as usually my russian friends write it.
And polish friends write it Zhukovski.
It seemed me no difference at all.
You guys are able always to find something to argue about.
That is nuisance. No matter at all. Best regards to everybody.