Jews in Ukraine

[Shevster]

Hi Alex,

This bartosz is a fool and a bigot. At this moment using Jewish suffering as a tool to hit Ukraine, yet he refuses to see all the harm the Polish have brought upon the Jews.

I don't have the time to post fully at the moment but will return soon with more info on Jews in the Galician area of East Europe.

If you have any questions for me please feel free to ask.

Stepan.

Are you Jewish?

[jimmi]

Originally posted by Shevster
Hi Alex,

This bartosz is a fool and a bigot. At this moment using Jewish suffering as a tool to hit Ukraine, yet he refuses to see all the harm the Polish have brought upon the Jews.

I don't have the time to post fully at the moment but will return soon with more info on Jews in the Galician area of East Europe.

If you have any questions for me please feel free to ask.

Stepan.

Are you Jewish?

Stepan sometimes uses the arguments that are very difficult to argue against, but if we reject the package (99% of the content) and extract the core (1%) and concentrate on interpretation (friction of the second - he has easy and in some circles popular style) we finally get the true meaning of his mail which one is able to present in following points:

1. Steve disagrees Bartosz
2. Steve is angry with Bartosz
3. Steve considers that the intention of Bartosz is hurting Ukraine (even if I was an super egocentric I wouldn't even imagine how)
4. Steve considers that for Bartosz Poland is a sacred cow and he's wrong because unlike Steve for Bartosz generally there's nothing is sacred; Steve, Poland and Ukraine included.
5. Steve considers that because Jews suffered in Poland (what Bartosz has never negated) they had their Walhalla on Ukraine.

In order to let Alex learn something else about Jewish tragic history in Ukraine and Poland I recommand 'Europe - the history' of Norman Davies, who is neither Ukrainian, no Pole or Jew but English of Scottish origin. For Steve ethnically suspected individuum.

Another etnically undetermined fellow

Bartosz - temporarily Jimmi

[steve_vlasenko]

Bartosz the biographer of the near legendary Norman Davis!!!
His book is the thing grandparents buy when then hear their grandchildren are interested in history in school. As his biographer, surely you should know what country he's from.

AleXG,

An excellent book to check out is A Peoples Tradedy. The 'Russian Revolution' 1891 √ 1924. Orlando Figes. (it focus on the territory of the former USSR not just Russia)This book pulls no punches in it's description of Jewish suffering in this period.

Take care.

Vlas.

[Bartosz]

Originally posted by steve_vlasenko
Bartosz the biographer of the near legendary Norman Davis!!!
His book is the thing grandparents buy when then hear their grandchildren are interested in history in school. As his biographer, surely you should know what country he's from.

AleXG,

An excellent book to check out is A Peoples Tradedy. The 'Russian Revolution' 1891 √ 1924. Orlando Figes. (it focus on the territory of the former USSR not just Russia)This book pulls no punches in it's description of Jewish suffering in this period.

Take care.

Vlas.

The problems begin not when granpas buy the book, but when decide to replace its content with their faded commemoraties.

Alex, If you want larger your knowlage of the subject read following articles from collective work of Krzysztof Jasiewicz:

Dov Levin : The importance of the of 1939-1941 transition period for Holocaust

Ewa Siemiaszko, WЁadysЁaw Siemiaszko: Homicide commited by Ukrainians in the WoЁyЯ area during WW2.

Under consideration.

[Irena]

Astonishing people these Jews... Everybody MUST repent before them. The Germens repented, the Swisses repented... But the Jews themselves... Are they going to repent before other people?
Did you see the polish film "Good Friday"? (I forget maybe Vaida?) A very good film...

[NORRYM]

No ethnic group can claim exclusive licence to demand and expect accountability for the wrongs committed against it. I do not think Jews are claiming exclusivity - they are just better and more persistent at seeking accountability. The book title "THE MURDERERS AMONG US" can very well be applied to contemporary Ukraine. But where are public outcries? Where are the documentaries, the investigative reportings, the secret archives findings - to bring forward the accusations and demands for accountability and possible punishment for crimes against humanity? The former sadistic servants and stooges of the Secret Police [NKVD, KGB] , the Communist Party hacks who controlled the prisons and the courts, they all are among us and to this day they carry the spilled blood of their blood-brothers/sisters on their consciences, without any formal accountability. Are their dastardly deeds less heinous than those of the foreign invaders? Crimes against your own people cry even harder for signs of REPENTANCE and ultimately for JUSTICE! emkay/01/16/01

[Edited by NORRYM on 16th January 2001 at 12:55]

[Bartosz]

Originally posted by Irena
Astonishing people these Jews... Everybody MUST repent before them. The Germens repented, the Swisses repented... But the Jews themselves... Are they going to repent before other people?
Did you see the polish film "Good Friday"? (I forget maybe Vaida?) A very good film...

Statistically these fellows were the most often the victims of any persecutions. Because of that they are privilaged.